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@DEVs: Features Which Are Effectively Off The Table

Discussion in 'Ask the Team' started by 0strum, Jul 7, 2017.


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  1. Having seen this development process in EvE, I can only say that it was worth the wait for that game. It took a couple of years to basically rebuild the EvE source code from the ground up as far as I understood it, but it brought EvE to a state where now they deliver frequent content patches every couple of month. So much even, that it is hard to keep up to date all the time. It, however, took a couple of years of almost no content, where the team focussed only on building these systems.
    My great hope is, that eternal crusade will endure through this phase of system building like EvE did, and not get cancelled midway through.
    I would much rather have a game, that is modular enough for the developers to integrate new stuff, even at a slow pace, than wait another couple of years until someone decides to make a new awesome wh40k game and has to start all over from scratch.
    kotovasy, Vae, Cyborg_Dragon and 2 others like this.
  2. prootinator proot Recruit

    Thanks Nathan, I appreciate it.
    Oveur likes this.
  3. Imperator5 Imperator5 Well-Known Member

    Indeed this should be posted on steam by BE. It explains a lot of what they are doing and thus helps confused customers.
    Nightkeeper and Oveur like this.
  4. Shakalaka Recruit

    Let me just say...Heck yeah... ive loved this game since i got into the early access and seeing its potential is what has kept me playing this long long time, seeing the rebalancing and other effects come into play, @Noah thank you for spelling out what i was hoping to see, this games potential.
    Oveur likes this.
  5. Kalenath Kalenath Subordinate

    But asking people on the internet to be patient works ALMOST as well as asking the Inquisition to not consider something heresy.

    IF this game can stay the course, then it has a chance. There are a LOT of players who want this game to succeed. Who didn't see Nathan come in, go in their pants and blame him for their lack of control.

    I do want to slay heretics and xenos for the Emperor and Russ but I want a game that has room to expand as well. Any contractor will tell you that to build anything you need to lay a good foundation first. They seem to be doing that and more power to them.

    I am not saying the game doesn't have problems or that I wouldn't love more content. It does and I most certainly would. I just hope that they can get it streamlined and efficient enough to make it worthwhile in time to keep the publisher from pulling the plug.

    Because in the grim darkness of today's world there is only money.
    kotovasy, Doomness1000 and Oveur like this.
  6. KillSlim KillSlim Prefectus

    I don't think Eve or CCP are very comparable. CCP at the time had around 350-400 employees post-restructuring, all working on Eve. They closed one of their studios, cancelled (and then sold the rights and assets of) another MMO project of theirs, all hands on deck were working on Eve to get the ship righted. Eve didn't get cancelled mid-way through because the game was still profitable, but not enough to support development of several MMO's at once. If you don't believe that you can go and read the financial reports for the studio at the time.

    Nathan doesn't have 350-400 employees, he has 5, who have been tasked with fixing a rapidly sinking ship while trying to keep the distressed passengers on board paying for drinks.

    While nothing may be cut forever, everything we consider traditional content is cut indefinitely. There still won't be any endgame content, no guild functionality, no new cosmetics, no new maps, etc. We will see minor quality of life improvements and minor balance tweaks. I'm betting a few people will continue playing, maybe even those who stopped will play again for a while as of Nathan's comment here ... but for how long?

    How long until those players will get frustrated again by the same old problems that made them quit in the first place? How long will they endure it? And how long will they place EC in it's current state over all the new releases this year?
  7. Mainfold Mainfold Preacher

    A "map system tool" that could be made (if allowed by GW), that would probably make the game have endless replayability, would be a "map-tiles" system, where there were set premade pieces that players could go into a "map creation" tool in the game, and make a map like a bunch of racing games do and doom etc. Would be really cool, as it would open up endless unique battles like assembling battlefields in the style of how it's done for TT. But is it likely to ever happen? No, doubt it strongly.

    If that ever did, the game's sales would probably skyrocket
  8. Nathan Richardsson Oveur Senior Producer

    Let's note that I did not list all our possible systems we can take on next, I listed examples that I thought were easy to relate to. World Map is very much a system.

    I also thought I mentioned campaigns under objectives?

    No system, in an online game, is ever finished. The paradigm shift that arrived with online games, is they continue to evolve. You don't get a disk and that's it. Not even a patch. So yeah, the campaign systems is at 1.0 and far from done. Framework is there to expand upon though.

    Regarding pre-requisites, that's such a huge question that it's impossible to answer. Pretty much EVERYTHING has pre-requisites, sometimes many of them from different systems.

    The world map and Campaigns et al isn't a hard pre-requisite for the road to open world. We've already said how we'd do open gameplay on Arkhona in a 40K context. Warframe is doing it in an interesting way, also hub-and-spoke:

    Except no fishing or handcrafting. We're far more simple and systemic than that, and more towards a hybrid of PUBG and King of the Kill rather than anything else. Well, with pants at least.
    Kiwik and KaelaMenshaKhaine like this.
  9. Nathan Richardsson Oveur Senior Producer

    The PVE maps are created with procedural assembly, rogue-like, in mind. It's all rooms! It lacks ... the systems!

    But making our entire game moddable, or providing a player-drive map editor, that's an insane amount of work. The games that have that today (from Civ to Total War) started a decade ago making their engines from the get-go moddable, and basically the core game is a huge "mod" itself. I hope that gives you an idea for scale.

    I'd rather go open-source. That's easier as UE4 is open-source already.

    Also, you have some misconception of what GW does. They own the IP, we're based on lore (as opposed to TT). The way we put maps together just, we just have to use approved assets, which we have, and make sure a procedural-ish generated doesn't put a Chaos room in the middle of an Eldar map. Just common sense.
    Sily and Kiwik like this.
  10. Nathan Richardsson Oveur Senior Producer

    Being the Senior, and Executive Producer of EVE Online, I can tell you, there were never 350-400 people on EVE alone (I was the Exec for 450 of them back then). EVE team was traditionally around 120-150 after we grew, unless you count the Dust team which of course is EVE. I started with 7 engineers when I joined EVE. So let's take that into consideration, 5 isn't a bad starting point with a core structure we have :D

    But everything else you state is more or less correct.
    Sily, Kiwik, Hralius and 1 other person like this.
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