Primarily, I main LSM (Loyalist fanboy cuck here) and apparently, according to the World Map and the games I've been in, we are getting spanked hard. I'm curious as to the reasons for such. I imagine an aspect of it can be that most of the newer players are going to play LSM, and due to the larger population of the LSM faction, other non-LSM factions are likely to end up facing LSM in more matches...But even in games I've found myself in where LSM outnumber other factions (Orkz/Eldar/CSM) and we have plenty of rank 4+ players, I've often found that we can barely eke out a victory...In some occasions, even when we have greater numbers we still end up being cock slapped by other factions. I also enjoy the after battle chat being not offensive or cancerous at all... Is it seriously just a matter of LSM really needing to "git gud?" When I'm not playing LSM, I play Eldar, and without even playing seriously, we just walk over LSM and people talk as if it's simply that LSM don't coordinate or even try to play. Playing LSM, we try to coordinate...And when we manage to get a sizable force onto a node to start capping, we typically are easily wiped out even though I'm in "try hard" mode. Maximum effort just to try to keep a cap going. I don't mean this to come off ultra-salty...But maybe a little salty, cause it's rough to lose over and over, and have enemy factions commenting "Easy" or "Haha, LSM-tards learn to not fail!" But I want to try and keep the discussion as civil as we can manage in these forums. Like I said, I'm just coming back and am looking for a little insight. Perhaps it really is that I need to "git gud" along with the majority of players of my primary faction...But when I hop on other factions, the fight doesn't feel as rough. Are there any thoughts you have as to why this may be the case? Any mechanics change that have negatively affected LSM more than other factions? How are other factions holding up compared to each other (e.g. Orkz v Eldar?) I appreciate your input (assuming it's not volatile and inflammatory.)
Here's my outlook on the current balance. CSM are at the top of the food chain right now, auto-cannons are really good and Sorcerers are probably the best healer in the game right now. The ability to have 2 cap classes also helps the faction immensely. LSM are a little behind, but they are definitely in a good spot. Apothecaries are good healers, and make decent pseudo-tacticals. Grav weapons are good versus melee, making them prime choices versus melee factions like CSM, however they are particularly useful against Eldar. Orks are fine, I don't have an opinion here, they are such a rare sight nowadays and their player base seems to be tiny. They aren't as tanky as they were at launch, but are still pretty beefy. The new pen changes that are coming will hurt them though. Eldar are gimmicky, roadkill still hasn't been fixed. Eldar still have a lot of balancing to go, with a lot of their weapons being not very good. That's not to say the faction is bad, far from it. If your LSM, there a few options for counters. For CSM, really your gonna have a rough time. Heavy Bolters help vs Auto-cannons, but you are vulnerable if your team leaves you alone. Vs Orks, there is a gun in the later lootboxes called the Vengeance Stormbolter, it should help vs their close range dakka. Grav-weapons aren't very good vs Orks, but meltaguns ignore toughness. This helps vs their shear bulk. With Eldar, your best advantage is range. Eldar lack long range firepower. Their only options are Reapers and not many people play them. If Hawks are shooting you, don't be scared and shoot back. Grav-cannons are also very good vs Eldar vehicles. Never park your Rhinos if you can help it, keep them moving. Lastly Stormbolters are excellent vs Dire Avengers. Also, tactic vs everyone. Use Meltabombs (or Krak grenades vs Eldar), vehicle control is key to winning matches. I often find LSM lose a lot because they don't take care of Transports, theirs or the enemies'. Really, if you want to have a better time, find a guild. That should help with coordination.
We have more new players that don't want to learn and we also don't have a real identity. That's why our team compositions are all over the place all the time. We have a few weapons that don't really do much but annoy people or just look cool. Stalker Bolter is meh, its recoil actually limits its ROF which is funny. Gravgun is hilarious, literally just a novelty weapon or used to annoy melee classes, not really that dangerous. Gravcannon is pretty much just used to counter Eldar combines. You will see people use it as a normal weapon, no reason to, use a multi-melta instead. Those three pretty much, rest is fine. We don't exactly have an Autocannon equivalent weapon for Loyalists to use. inb4eldar
When Playing LSM myself i also think that the greatest fault of LSM is just the ammount of new and inexperianced people that participate. Practically every Newblood will try out LSM first it seems. And while i can't make any good measurements, i can definitly tell by the Scoreboard (And the Level-symbols) that i seem to be on the right track. Also while playing different factions, you totally feel a difference when it comes to teamplay. CSM: Back in the days of alpha, when there were only LSM and CSM, LSM had all the guilds while people were playin CSM because of queuetimes beeing shorter. CSM Pugs constantly had to fight vs guilds and as such they had to learn teamwork. Now those times are quite far gone (luckily) but this experiance still stickes with the CSM Faction. It feels like. Be it over Chat or Discord groups (also non guilds do that!) they work together, rescue People, bodyblock the one who caps and Sorcerer actually seek out the wounded instead of jumping into battle (more or less) Together with the Tools Chaos has, they make up quite a formadible Enemy ORKS: Again, back in the days where there were only LSM and CSM, Potentiall Ork-Players were queueing for Chaos, and recieving the same experiance. Not only that, but ork-players seem to be teamplay-people. Not only do they hype each other up with their ork-language and roleplay, they also fight quite well. Orks also got a lot of Weapons to choose from, are Beasts in melee and got a lot of different guns (Ace Dakka = Autocannon, Plasmacannon in the form of their Cannon Deffgun, Lascannon etc.) They work together and their gear works most of the time. ELDAR: When Eldar were introduced first, they had a lot of pain to go through. Their Melee barly working, their Guns either overpowered so they teamkill, or not relevant at all. But they still were playing their favorite Faction, and became good with all those flaws. Now that most (but by far not all of those) are patched, they still retain their skill, their memory of how to make the broken versions work, and use that with deadly efficiency. Eldar may be few (lore-accurate!) but those who play eldar, do it quite well. They still have a lot of stuff that needs fixing, but their dedication, together with lag maybe benefiting them, they can hold their own quite well. Eldar are super effective, but hard to master. Newbies may try eldar, fail on eldar, and leave eldar, or become good enough to stay. LSM: There are 2 parts of this faction, and once the match starts you instantly realize in wich part the Matchmaker threw you. 1) The Guilds or the "Good" 2) The Newbs or the "Ugly". Do not get me wrong, nobody starts out perfect and we all were noobs once, nothing wrong with that. But when the vast majority of Newbloods sit in one faction, enough to make a full match, things get dangerous. Whenever you fight guilds or experianced players, they are more then cappable to outplay you. The difference between Chaos and LSM Gearwise get bigger every patch (good so!) but roughly it can be said, LSM got the same tools as chaos, not as strong, but also with no disadvantages like Marks have eg. Their Healers work completly different, but nonetheless efficient and good... if you know how to play em. And this is the crux. New Players seem to not realize that every class can pick up downed people, but leave that to an apothecary, he who got no clue either, tries to rez you with "E" first and asks over chat "How do i heal?" later on. Not only with the apothecary, but also Tacticals not knowing what their job is, nowhere to be found near capture-points, Devastator rushing in even before JPA's and GA's thinking their Shields protect them from everything... And those newbies, who start out bad, but become good, after a while they try out other factions, but this time with some experiance how the game works. And whatever faction they join, they join as somewhat experianced people. One could argue LSM is the training-camp of all other factions And now you have that Newbloods, making up whole matches fighting against the other 3 Factions that mostly stem from experianced players who know what they are doing and... well... I know where all the cries for nerfs come from, or why LSM seem to get yet another buff in the future according to twitch.
Also, as a point of reference, I'm in a guild (PG) and I'm rank 6. Just been playing for the campaign wins...Which went smooth, then stopped...
Current state of the crusade is pretty much the same as it has been for months. Beta quality overall. Nothing much has changed except for some minor balance adjustments and the addition of campaigns, which do nothing but give some semblance of a goal to play towards. "Grind matches for your weekly premium currency" pretty much sums them up. You'll never win a campaign playing as LSM though, sorry to say. The only major change that can be confirmed right now is an overhaul on weapon penetration coming soon.
Yeah, LSM are not going to win campaigns unless a guild goes on a rampage. Their high pop count works against them.
Guilds on voice comms >> everything. That said, the PUG experience... I started several weeks ago as LSM. I got a feel for the game, mostly playing with a buddy, got crushed 90% of the time, and merely lost another 5%. The wins were when we out-popped by a large margin. This pattern has held throughout. It is rare to see any teamwork that you don't bring with you. People friendly-fire, intentionally TK, and screw other squad's rhinos. People run from heals, and don't know how to cap points, or how the timers work. It's...bad. Started up my eldar toon, mostly playing with the same buddy, and the very first thing I noticed was the faction chat being used to talk about the battle instead of raging and idiotic in-fighting. Much higher win rate, and finally felt like I was playing a team game. Occasionally winning against a guild squad even, though never against 2. Started up my ork toon this week, mostly playing with the same buddy, and we won a lot of our matches, under-pop on all of them at the beginning, usually starting at 4-7 people (which means the two of us on our default kits are a 25%-50% of the team). Some of those losses were against against guild squads. The coordination amongst PUGs was the highest of the three. Also a ton of fun playing, win or lose. Orks have a great attitude, it seems. Can't wait to try CSM next. From everything I've seen, you can have fun on LSM but you need a warparty, or better yet, a guild. It doesn't help that the tutorials and in-game information is so lacking, and that everyone and their dog starts with LSM first (as I did). But those same new people have to wade through raw sewage in LSM faction chat in ways the other factions don't seem to have to deal with. It's an unfortunate combination.
