All for expansion of the game but can you imagine the blowback from a faction that is supposed to be FASTER and more AGILE ( in both movement speed and melee speed) than Craftworld Eldar, have iconic weapons like the husk blade or dark lance which are universally described as one shotting everyone regardless of armor or toughness and have a huge selection of "condition" based weaponry ( whether its poison, or pain, or fire) which is controversial in the game as is. Then there's the fact they are even more reliant on speed an movement ( than craftworld eldar) to survive which would put them at a disadvantage in the static objective based game world BE designed ( especially with the lack of holo-fields or any other mitigating cannon tech or abilities)unless they received similar tweaks to their base stats. Even basic "balancing" would put them in danger of being simply reskins while any attempt to keep them in line with their cannon flavor would instantly create eye of terror level maelstroms of "OP!! OP!!". Incubi are fast as normal DE and have armor that is as strong as power armor, weapons that increase the power of their strikes and psychic torture devices! ( though scorps don't have mandiblasters so BE might ignore those) Considering that the Eldar OP nerf bandwagon is still going strong despite the patch and evidence to the contrary introducing a faction that is in fact unrepentantly and gleefully OP even within the confines of the IP (numerous sources state that the only reason they haven't taken over the galaxy is they are afraid/unable/unwilling to stay outside the webway for too long for fear of slaneesh, no soulstones or psykers or other soul drain mitigation in real-space, they still get soul drain in the webway hence the torturing but they are "hidden" there. ) would probably just explode the website.
@Dunedhel Though in fairness the evidence to the contrary is more that they are somewhat less OP, rather than no longer OP at all. Eldar are still winning (only just) against every other faction if you check the World Map.
Let's not discuss the status of the Craftworld Kin in this thread if we can folks. This is all about the dark denizens of Commorragh! In regards to Hellions, I'd love to see them in-game but I just don't see it being added in easily. It'd be a real struggle to do their animations unless they just flew around like jetbikes all the time. Plus.. how would they work in melee? Andd.. imagine how ridiculous it would look just seeing four skyboard cruising around in a tiny room like on most of the maps. In regards to the toughness of Dark Eldar being implemented in game, currently Space Marines are at 200 health, 100 armor, and 100 toughness with basic gear. Assuming health and toughness relate directly to their tabletop stats (4 toughness) we could divide the armor and health by 4 (getting 50 health and 25 toughness). We can then multiply it by 3 (basic toughness for Dark Eldar on TT) and we'd get 150 health, and 75 toughness. We can also apply this principle to the space marine armor which is on TT a 3+ save and in EC 100 armor. Dark Eldar Kabalites meanwhile have a 5+ armor save which should equal out to 50 armor theoretically. Wyches meanwhile would suffer from a pathetic 25 armor, which is kind of fair considering that they're pretty much wearing bondage gear. And Scourges would get about 75 armor. That is of course assuming we're using Space Marines for our base comparison. If this were the case.. and the basic bolter does 38 damage at 20m.. It would take two shots to take out a Kabalite's armor shield (If not one because it should pen their armor), and four more to finish them off for a grand total of about six bolter shots. Against a Wych it'd be about 5 shots. And against a Scourge it'd be about six as well. Personally I could live with this. I'd be more than happy to die in a few shots as a Wych, they should rightfully get eaten alive by bolters.
Making some definite sense here. It's good to have numbers. And those levels would address @Dunedhel 's concerns a bit. If bE can optimize enough that faster races don't lag the anti eldar bandwagon would curtail somewhat cause that is compounding other peoples frustrations with eldar speed. If they were faster than current craft world Eldar but dropped in 4 or 5 shots from a bolter i doubt people would take cries of DE OP to seriously when their opponents basic rifles are tearing through them like tissue paper. But there are Legitimate Concerns about the Incubi, but i have an Idea, If we were to line their armor up alongside their Shrine cousins, the Scorpions probably as they are kinda related. Then give them a channeled ability to strengthen their armor. That way they could survive much more than anyone else in the DE line up while focusing. But if they shift their attention to actually hitting someone their toughness drops, opening them up to being flanked or shot by other opponents... then again that's a work around so We might start complaining if that had to happen to make the Dark Kin fair... Still would be fun, Meanwhile, Hellions do kinda present a problem with the skyboard, but if we keep the scourges then we don't really need the second jump troop and Wytches would be interesting to play, if we line them up with some of the suggestions I've heard it would be almost a "Well you didn't shoot them before they got to melee range, it's your fault" kind of gameplay style. Which would be interesting *edit* oh and putting them into the craftworld line up later on would also be interesting. A melee elite could be the Incubi a tough frontliner or a scourge as a heavy damage suppressor with altitude advantage... ooohh or dare i hope... a Mandrake */edit*
Mandrakes would actually be fantastic. It'd be a decent sneaky unit like Scorpions albeit they'd have absolutely zero armor, even less than Wyches (On TT they don't have armor, only cover saves). Because of this I think the only way to properly implement them would be to give them a stealth even better than the Scorpion stealth (Mandrakes have Infiltrate, Shrouded, and Stealth, compared to Scorpions with only Infiltrate and Stealth). They should rightfully get murdered in a straight up fight against anything and have to use their stealth for survival (Meaning unlike Scorpions they couldn't act as front line troops). I can see them in EC acting as the Dark Eldar's 'assassin' unit, basically sneaking into the enemy's rear lines and popping lone Devastators and the like (Which is also what you use them for in TT mostly) Perhaps to help better implement the Mandrakes their stealth could last longer and not fade away as fast once they begin to move. In regards to weapons I believe it'd be best to stick to the TT loadout with them only having basic close combat weapons, limiting their close quarters abilities. Yet their Bale Blast would be nifty as all hell. Just shooting out a flash of fiery green energy that sets the enemy ablaze. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ In regards to @Faeron 's PFP idea. I think that's actually a way cooler way to go about it! If PFP (Power From Pain) was instead based on the kill count current in the match with DE deaths adding 2 to the counter and enemy deaths adding 1, it would probably give a better feel to the Army. Also it could be added incrementally, basically after 50 deaths maybe they get PFP level 1 (We'll say 75 kills/deaths for starters) with increased toughness. At PFP level 2 (125 kills/deaths) perhaps they get a buff to their melee damage.
I actually had an idea on the Mandrake to make it feel unique but give it a similar spot in the game to the Striking Scorpion, They have tiny amount of armor, in addition to this they have no range weapon. To compensate for these handycaps they do more damage in melee, (think 30% stealth bonus permenantly) they have a slight shimmer effect (again around 20% stealth camo comparing them to a Full cloak scorpion) and they have a channeled ability that takes them out of phase. They take and deal no damage while channeling the ability, for a limited time, say a 75 charge that drains about as quick as the warlock jinx charge. Idealy in game this would make them a bit harder to see but not too much, and give incentive to keep them at a distance(thats quite a bit of melee damage) but on the other hand they can't retaliate at range, and their ability while incredibly potent, it short timed and can't be used while sprinting or attacking. Hopefully this ability would let them use it to move from cover to cover, or as a last couple seconds before jumping into melee if they're spotted at the last second, But would not give them enough time to try a direct charge... It also would be bad to try and front line melee because the bullets pass through them... and hit allies behind you.
Mandrakes could be the Striking Scorpion copy. Talos Pain Engine could be a hero to counter the Terminator/Wraithguard thing.
Honestly I don't think Sslyth would work. Don't get me wrong I'd love to see it, but can you imagine the animations? I get the feeling either they'd look completely hilarious and stupid, or downright glorious.
