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What needs to change??

Discussion in 'Eldar' started by Sneaky-krumpin, Apr 14, 2017.

  1. Elemir Swiftblade Warriant Arkhona Vanguard

    More damage on most weapons. I'd be fine if we had the EHP we have now if we had the offensive power to make up for it but we simply don't.
    Sily, Niothewarlock and Paeyvn like this.
  2. LucianNostra Well-Known Member

    it's 3200 less HP.

    Rhino = 8,000
    Wave Serpent = 4800

    Wave Serpent also has weak surfaces in the dual cockpits so it takes full damage to the rear and those two places.

    It's a pretty big deal that every none Eldar player wants to ignore. Taking something like 8 frontal shots from a Lascannon to down another Rhino vs 3 to take out a Wave Serpent is a pretty major change.
    Sily, Paeyvn and Dragonkindred like this.
  3. Dragonkindred Dragonkindred Arkhona Vanguard

    Not to mention how shit the main gun is on the Falcon.
    Sily and Paeyvn like this.
  4. Brosephelon Recruit


    I'd argue differently.

    An unattended wave serpent is super easy to kill because of the extra weak point and low hp.
    The big difference is that an attended wave serpent is a downright monster compared to a crewed rhino/trukk being more or less a joke.

    You can meltabomb a moving rhino/trukk, you cannot meltabomb a moving wave serpent odds are it will probably flick its mouse to the side and roadkill you instantly anyhow if you get close. Considering that outside of fortress maps the primary way to assassinate vehicles by all factions is the meltabomb having increased ability to avoid them due to hovering while meltabombs "fall" is a huge advantage many eldar seem to overlook.

    I actually think wave serpents are pretty balanced overall and its more an issue with meltabombs in general being too polarizing across all factions. Yeah the roadkill shit needs to be toned down and anyone with half a brain knows it, that aside most of the vehicle balance issues in terms of transports come down to how easy it is to suicide meltabomb rush them down. Give meltabombs a setup time, and give them a bit more reach so that they can easily be placed on surfaces at head level like grav tanks or planting them on tanks from under them in a trench or something like that.
    You do that you take care of a whole lot of issues, and it also opens up the possibility of actually making fusion guns better and making Fire Dragons more of a main stay trooper even if they do have two meltabombs because they can't just suicide rush a defended vehicle and profit.


    Though back to the heart of the thread about what I think Eldar need as a whole would be armor buffs. They can keep a lower EHP if you want I think its "fine" in most cases. Though I'd like that EHP more forward facing in the armor and possibly even give Eldar armor a natural recovery speed increase to go along with this. Basically you give Eldar the speed and armor to play peaking games where they pop out shoot some shurikans in you take a bolt or two in trade then dip away get their armor back and repeat.
    The entire concept of making Eldar the fast evasive race is wasted with low armor values. I think simply flip flopping hp/armor values and rewarding armor stacking more (possibly giving Eldar stronger armor trinkets too both with entirely new armor trinkets that might cost 30 or 40lp a piece but also within increasing the armor value of current trinkets) is a great way to help solidify the identity the game design is going for while also keeping them balanced.

    I'd also like the ingame physical size of the plasma grenade increased, its very hard to shoot a plasma nade to make it detonate early which is actually a very valid and useful tactic to other races but not as much to Eldar and changing that would be a great high skill cap way of improving Eldar.

    Personally I'd also like to up the DPS on Eldar shuriken and las guns but also give them faster cone of fire expansion that rewards higher skilled aiming/fire control with higher potential dps while also limiting the ability to just spray things down. I think the current overall dps is in a decent place for most weapons, but I'd like to shift it a bit more to be burst oriented, this again helps emphasis the hit and run factional theme works with the concept of the higher armor and such mentioned above and above all gives the Eldar play more of a means to outplay others by gameplay and tactics not just raw power.


    Atleast thats my take on the issue, I love play swooping hawks and I absolutely despise most Eldar players on the forums. Maybe you guys disagree and thats fine but I figured I'd just toss my two cents out there.
  5. Dragonkindred Dragonkindred Arkhona Vanguard

    There is nothing wrong with your 2 cents. Don't feel that your opinion is less important than others (even if they disagree or bag you out).

    Personally, I don't agree with you assessment of Melta bombing grave tanks being a lot harder than others. The slightest movement of any tank stops melta bombs from "sticking" to the target. This is not an Eldar only thing.
    I've sideswiped many targets when piloting a grave tank and I can assure you it is not an instant kill. You have to be going a decent speed to have any effect and you have to be going directly towards your target to do damage.
    Sily, 3dferocity and Paeyvn like this.
  6. Brosephelon Recruit

    You can walk up to a stationary unpiloted grav tank, press G, and have the bomb fall to the floor. This does not happen with any other races vehicles as far as I have seen because they all have flat services all the way to the ground to latch onto. You literally have to be balls deep into the grav tank to get the meltabomb to stick.
    Its not impossible or even hard to work around, but its harder than other factions for no legit reason besides "meltabombs immediately fall with zero forward momentum" which is a non-issues vs other factions vehicles but a legit issue vs Eldar.
  7. Forever Dancing First Blood!

    Have to say the curve on the back of the rhino has made me miss sticking a few meltas before. Not often but I have missed. :EldarDragon:
    Brujah likes this.
  8. Brosephelon Recruit

    I've had that happen as a FD with double bomb by trying to put a meltabomb ontop of another meltabomb, perhaps thats whats happening with you? Apprently bombs don't latch to bombs lol
  9. Forever Dancing First Blood!

    No the back of a rhino has a slight angle from top too bottom. I just put it down to noobish mistakes when I throw the bomb and it lands on the floor.
    Sily likes this.
  10. Redhatter Redhatter Arkhona Vanguard

    DAs and reapers need to be stronger, Eldar just lack the dakka atm.

    When the Eldar were first brought into the game I was under the impression that they would have the strongest ranged and the weakest melee with them generally being less tough and having less strength than the other races.
    Sily, Paeyvn and Krayt like this.

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