Question is what it is - I would honestly like someone to try and explain what makes Eternal Crusade's premise so attractive. A lot of arguments around are based on the fact that the appeal of EC is to be in an open world, fighting wars and stuff without any boundaries and lobbies; but I don't see how that's important.

Let me try and explain my plight: To me, 40k isn't generally a very adventurous setting, and going out on your own without direction doesn't feel like it makes sense the same way it would in a traditional MMO (which I know EC isn't; bear with me here). I can totally see the appeal of large maps with several areas to fight in, but not as open instances where you can do whatever. Instead, going to a point in an instance you've logged into, because a leader decided to put a marker there, that makes sense to me, and seems very 40k-like. It makes me feel like I have a goal, something to work for, and directions, and that's very important in these kinds of games. Dropping me randomly outside a large battle, like in PS2, does not. I just jump down and fight, because there's a fight. It's like the rest of the map isn't important, really.

Secondly; what's so important about large scale battles? I simply do not get it. I can see how it appeals to a 40k fan - the setting is famous for some truly massive battles and wars - but from a gameplay angle, I don't see it. As with the above example, to me, it blurs the game's focus; if we're supposed to fight over singular points with a Squad of around 5-8 people, what's the importance of 492 other players running around somewhere? The only things that really, mechanically has importance to you, are any players you meet on the battlefield, and that's not a lot of people, honestly. I can see the appeal of 40v40, 50v50, maybe a bit more, but more as "raid"-like areas; fights that are special and rare, but not regular battles with up to 500 players.

Can you elaborate on why you look forward to an open world, massive shooter game with many hundred players? I legitimately want to know, 'cause I just don't see it.

And, sorry to be rude, but please elaborate beyond "IT'S AWSUM, WAAAAAAGH!", because while that's a given reason, it's also a shallow reason. I would love a persistant MMO where you play an Inquisitor in the entire 40k setting, with every planet and every war ever, because that's awesome; but it's also unfeasable.

TLR - What about EC's premise is important to you, and why?

I just want a game that lets you play as something other than SM/CSM that isn't an RTS.

God PLEASE give me some Eldar already.

Because watching two fire prisms going up in flames while a squad of 7 Swooping Hawks follow their exarch into the fiery inferno as Dark reapers lay down suppressive fire makes my rocks hard. Because seeing the large-scale war only depicted in mainstream FPS gets redundant and a Warhammer 40k MMO that can properly depict the grotesque scope of combat with livid designs and vastly different factions adds something to the market that some people have waited decades for.

Now, I see that as the exact same argument as "40k iz awsum!". Way more eloquently put, but has the same feeling - You wanna see 40k in the flesh; and so do I. Problem is: How is that scene you described better made by an MMO with myraids of individual players, in comparison to a movie of sorts with actors? Players are stupid and independent; they won't do the most dramatic and awesome thing for you. They'll play for their own good.

So again; what is it that makes this premise so important?

I really like the idea of instance battle zones/grounds being locations on a large outdoor map. When you get to that battlezone, you enter the instance and there's the fight. So, the outdoor map is your "planning" area, or "social area" for people who want to roleplay or setup strats or organize forces. Then you all hop in rhinos, preds, thunderhawks (presumably) and you're off to the intended battleground in all your glory and rage. I think it would be cool if certain areas were open for you to be attacked while in transit, going along with the idea of advanced scouts reporting where you are going and what not, but it's all hypothetical at this point.

I really want a large scale map with places that are contested and fought over, I remember playing Neocron, Shadowbane and Eve, patrolling your territory looking for intruders large scale epic battles for territory... That is what I am hoping this game will eventually have.

It was fun for me to be part of that and wake up every day and look at the map and see how much has changed and who is challenging who. Don't get me wrong though, I will still play this game if it turns out to be just a lobby shooter but a lobby shooter won't keep my interest as long as a large scale open world with points being battled over for resources.

In response, guilds are the answer to this. Which, in my opinion, hopefully consumes entire chapters. Why do I want this? Guilds help enforce rules and train recruits making the chapters much more disciplined. Discipline is the key to an army: Following orders, staying put, supporting heavy bolters instead of leaving them to die. People organized into 'best fit squds.' Coupled with the armies being asymmetrically balanced (hopefully through the magics known as Devs) they will be forced to play like those races. This hopefully gives a feel where you are actively fighting against loyalists, the deadly Wit and speed of Eldar, or the overbearing Orkz. The MMO aspect will allow a full chapter/Waaagh!!/Craftworld to organize and actively attack and change the EC world as they claim territories.
So what is the appeal? A deeper immersion that movies and overhead games can't provide. And as our duty, we should be roleplaying what we are and act as such. Example: If you're an Ork, I better hear a WAAGH! from you and refer to the bigger greener Orkz as Boss.
Thus, combined with our overzealous Roleplaying abilities with military-like discipline enforced by guilds/clans this game should and could offer one of the deepest immersions in the W40k universe.

Have you ever played Planetside 2? Being involved in the massive battles on that when you are working in a platoon is just epic! No other game captures how much fun massive warfare truly is (in a game, not in real life)!! I like the tactical aspect of it with multiple groups of players all working together to achieve a common goal, it's why I used to play ArmA ACE mod.

If EC gets to that level I don't think I'll ever leave my PC because I'll get to play as a Space Marine in that kind of game!!!

I agree with OP in the sense I don't need a "traditional MMO" approach. Having a tactical map with hotzones, an overall battle strategy from high command, missions to take/defend/escort or whatever replaces traditionnal "quest". Open world is not mandatory for me, however it helps create a sense of immersion when you can go around a whole world, from a gameplay perspective it wouldn't add much.

400 vs 400 players. A lot of people are discontent with the TTK, a 16 vs 16 is very different from hundreds vs hundreds. Imagine you are locked down by 100 people shooting at you at the same time. Everyone will scream about how it doesnt feel epic because they dive in droves, vs firefights that last longer because there are less people shooting back at you when you are spotted.

Large scale battle come at a price, you die, a lot, unless you get a good team vs a bad one, and on equal footing with the enemy, this would become a pushing game where both sides take heavy casualties.

So basically my answer is actually, it,s not the Open world MMO that brought me to this game. To me that would just be icing on the cake.

I wanted a WH40K game where I get to fight, attack and defend, where I can play all races, get all the guns, create a character that looks badass with customisation. Space marines was ok, especially on the visual customisation style, but earning all the perks was fast but easier for those that got into early beta and harder (because unlocking certain stuff depended on your kill streaks or multikills). also space marines didn't have other playable races. the number of maps were limited, small, and far from the beauty, scope, and quality design of EC in terms of tactical possibility. Also, now, we get vehicles.

Now, what really is the biggest appeal to me, is the possibility, in the far future, to get crazy with all the races, classes, elites, heroes, weapons, etc. I mean tau, necrons, sisters, imperial guards (imperium), dark eldars, etc.
With chimeras, leman russes, looted tanks, battle wagons, maybe flyers down the line (maybe just as call-in strafing runs). Basically, what appeals to me is the way this game can be developped. I think they go for a model where things are "modular" in the sense that it is possible to had a lot of content once the core is set.

You may or may not have experienced it, but there were times where playing any of the DOW games you go, "Damn it you Librarian, why are executing that fellow when you have to run away from that tank, to go help that squad. If only I could control you a bit more and make you do something better", then Space Marine came out, novel concept, wasn't quite what it original iteration was though, it looked a lot more like what we're working with now (don't know the details, but something about Dark Millennium was too similar? Idk), but a ship sunk and it was left there to slowly seep away.
Now we're on the cusp of three races, combat is typically satisfying, plays much better now than it did 3 months ago, neat stuff happening, it's all promising essentially. It could still go south, but most things can til they hit a certain age. I prefer how it's set up as well, I liked WoW, but it wasn't very engaging as it ended up just becoming a strategy game for me, 60% of the time is spent picking abilities and the only interesting fights end up being PVP, but then I enjoyed PVE like Exterminatus/Last Stand, so now you're taking both, giving me the ability to screw up or excel removing 30 some abilities...ok, including my horsies... and allowing customization of some sorts that I'm eagerly awaiting. I'm semi certain you can see where I'm going with this.

Tldr More engaging this way, offers relatively diverse entertainment, looking forward to making a character more like me and less like motley Armour dying to melta cone.

I'm curious if folks will be able to focus on PVE and not have to do PVP (I know some don't enjoy fighting players for various reasons) or if it'll not be viable to be PVE...exclusive, I guess.