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UAT - Testing / Playing with Devs

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by jbregg, Mar 30, 2017.

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Are you interested in testing/playing with the Devs on the latest build?

  1. I'd want to play but not test.

  2. Not interested.

  3. Sign me up!

  4. I would be interested but the time of the test is an issue.

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Mainfold Mainfold Preacher

    You're drawing threads between things here that are not the planks of a charkha.. If one has access to tools that grants a quicker vehicle kill than every other faction, it is comparable in the sense of it being a more potent manner of dealing with vehicles.

    The relevance of this is still as much of a valid topic as the bundle itself. In the case of the FD, you have a class that has the tools akin to TWO classes of two other factions, combined into ONE class, with the possibility to utilize the tools in manners to vary the speed at which you can kill vehicles. You slap on two bombs? Instakill on vehicles. You slap one bomb and burn with beam? You kill the vehicle in the time it takes for the bomb to tick, and still have the chance to do it to another vehicle. You only use FR? You are as capable of killing vehicles in the same manner as a MCMM with just a TAD longer time spent burning with the beam, but a shorter cooldown time than MCMM, with a 1.4sec difference between second-beam starting.

    Assuming you don't additionally use a Fusion Pistol secondary you swap to the sec the heat maxes out on FR and maintain the ailment slightly longer.. in comparison to other factions, there's no shortage of variable ways to kill vehicles with the FD. It's not about comparing FR+bomb to MCMM, it's available tools and rapid nature of ability to kill vehicles.


    With FR you CAN start to use the beam (to conserve the bombs for other cases) and if someone is trying to stop you, you can use the bomb as an "emergency kill-guarantee" just to make sure you finish off the vehicle if you're gonna be stopped from beaming. Variety where variety is available, is more valuable than no variety.
  2. Krayt Krayt Preacher

    FR : -50% heat
    MM: -30% heat +25% damage +15m range

    FD dont have anything that is akin of two classes of other factions , you can repeat it as much as u want , a FR is not a MM as much as an SMG is not a MG

    everything you are stating is viable for csm/lsm too since they just need 1 melta bomb and a bit of woof of the hairdryer to destroy an eldar vehicle so they can use the "emergency kill-guarantee" as much as eldar
    Konok0 likes this.
  3. Mainfold Mainfold Preacher

    +20m max range. The "15m" and "30m" on them are from the old tooltips when they had damage-falloff, their current max ranges are 20 / 40. And if you're gonna use gun-analogies, it's more akin to a IWI Negev vs a FN Minimi Para (M249). The ultimate outcome of damage dealt is gonna end up the same, just how fast the damage is dealt and effective range differ.

    Orks get more shafted still.
    Krayt likes this.
  4. LucianNostra Well-Known Member

    I can answer that fairly easily, because the 2 bomb loadout is only perceived as OP by people that don't look at the reverse situation.

    I mean I would TOTALLY understand the bundle being OP if Eldar drove Rhinos but only we had access to the bundle, but the fact of the matter is that pound for pound a parked rhino and a parked wave serpent die so quickly it's nearly identical, yes it does take a smidge longer to wreck a wave serpent as you need to whack the bomb with the meltagun than give it like a.. quarter second punch vs just the half second it takes to plop 2 bombs on a rhino's butt.

    So when bE says vehicles dying damn near instantly isn't fun or well balanced I will believe them because it's not fun for marines when a FD runs up and insta-gibs a rhino nor is it fun when a marine runs up and damn-near insta gibs a WS. So to JUST nerf the Eldar bundle and MB to the point where it now requires more time to destroy a rhino by a large margin than it takes a marine to destroy a WS is not acceptable to me because that just means you've gimped Eldar in AV.

    Also as has been stated before the FD is the only dedicated AV class in Eternal Crusade, a class dedicated to the role of AV SHOULD be better than one that's not. Not just because it makes sense but because it's something else we need to spend our points on, we don't just chug up the gun line and happen to get cheaper meltas, we can't just slap the SAME exact armors that nearly all our classes do on our AV like Marines can, we also don't get capture keys on our AV trooper, so if our AV trooper is going to be AT best on par with a tactical marine or even possibly worse at the role of destroying enemy armor than yeah there should be some compensation.

    The final thing i'll point out is the old asymmetrical balance, right now there is very little the Eldar do better than the other races in roles that actually really matter, our forces can't stand up and fight like marines or orks, our heavy weaponry is subpar to other race equivalents, our line trooper is straight up inferior, one of our perks was the FD and that seems to be going away so yes it should be compensated

    edit: sorry i did forget one point, the other fact is even with a nerf to MBs.. lets say we made it equal melta-bomb insta gibbed a transport in 2 bombs, and we gave all factions a bundle, many would think that's balanced? but would it be? would there really be AV balance considering that Eldar long range AV still requires more shots to down an enemy faction transport which is only weak to the rear while ours have less hp and frontal weak zones? hmmm... nope it would mean Eldar AV is UP
    Saeritan and Konok0 like this.
  5. Lerdoc Katitof Well-Known Member

    We've explained it specifically to you multiple times in the past and I'll explain it to you once again with a hope that this time it'll penetrate your skull and gets through to you, so sit down and pay attention:

    Single melta bomb and a gentle pat from any weapon can kill skimmer on live since second hp nerf.
    Melta bundle basically allowed Eldar to do for premium cost what YOU could ALWAYS do to skimmers.

    Unless for somewhat magical and insane reason you consider eldar needing 0,5 sec to kill a rhino grossly imbalanced, but when TSM does the very exact same thing to skimmer its suddenly "perfect example of well balanced interaction".

    Stop being god damn ignorant hypocrite on the topic of melta bombs.

    To not completely break following AT weapons in the process:
    Lascannon
    Zzap cannon
    Reaper Launcher
    Power Fist
    Power Klaw
    Krak grenade
    Rokkit Launcher
    Meltagun
    Fusion gun
    Multimelta
    Grav weapons
    Literally all vehicle weapons

    So, what seems easier and more logical to you?
    Addressing a single problematic piece of wargear for all factions, or buffing vehicle health across the board and adjusting 20 weapons with completely different mechanics separately?
    Firskon likes this.
  6. Konoko Konok0 Arch-Cardinal

    So.. lascanon have 1800 damage? 3 shoot = 5400 damage.
    Serpent have 》5401 hp
    LucianNostra likes this.
  7. Keep it civil guys. @Katitof I don't care how much you don't like Njord that is no reason to personally insult him. Do not do it again.
  8. LucianNostra Well-Known Member

    Well that's something than I guess.. takes us more MBs but at least long ranged is 4 shots, if only rhinos had weak fronts now.
    Ondora likes this.
  9. jbregg jbregg Dev QA

    Going to do a playtest tomorrow on UAT for those interested.

    Things to test:

    Vehicles/Melta Bombs change

    TLASC buffed:
    reload times go from 3.4 -> 2.8 Empty / 2.9 -> 2.3 Left

    Shuriken Pistols buffed:
    go from .08 Shots interval to .09, Damage from 17 -> 19 Close / 8.5 -> 9.5 Far

    Eldar Vs SM @7:30PM UTC.
    Eldritch, Konok0, Talron and 2 others like this.
  10. Lady Rheeva Steam Early Access

    See, now we got ya thinking in the right direction! ^^
    Just one thing: TLASC is already meta. This is kinda what you don't want to do: buff meta-builds.
    Although I can't deny it will help in competing with other, tactical archetypes as DA.

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