Eh, I still don't like the idea of "tiers" of the same weapon or having to pray to the RNG for a favorable variance in stats. I think it would be interesting though if the WC had some way to invest in lines of Research and Development, which in turn would give faction-wide global modifiers. This would introduce a layer of strategy that the WC can reliably control, their R&D decisions will influence their faction's strengths and weaknesses. If this is done though, the cash shop absolutely cannot touch it. It must be completely isolated from the cash shop and unable to be influenced by real-life money in any way, to prevent factions from using cash to turbo-boost their research and become strong at everything. I guess it would also require a way to set everyone's research back to square one now and then, so we don't run into the situation where everyone has reached the end of all the trees and there's nowhere left to go. Perhaps it could be tied to the campaign cycle, or instead of being global it's a per-base development that is destroyed when you lose the base (so you generally get better stuff by spawning further away from the front line, in a base that your faction has held on to for a while).
Well, I'd rather not deal with 24h+ crafting times on a personal scale, but I suppose it wouldn't be as much of a problem for the WC because they're supposed to be looking at long-term stuff like that. I was thinking kind of similar to an RTS game, the WC researches a certain tech and for example all of the faction's plasma weapons take longer to overheat and/or cool down faster. Or for the base-by-base bonus, they upgrade a particular base and all plasma weapons pulled at that base have better cooling systems, until the base is lost. If bases have limited research slots then this could lead to strategies where you specialize some bases to produce certain weapons at very high quality. So instead of farming it up hoping the RNG drops you a Legendary Heavy Bolter of +20 Fire Rate [Emperor's Buzzsaw], you just make sure you spawn at Example Armory because you know the WC has stacked it with Heavy Bolter Fire Rate boosts. I think the facility-based system would probably open up more counterplay between factions, because if the Eldar are getting tired of the Space Marines' heavy bolters being ridiculously teched up, they can attack Example Armory and destroy their bonus, plus at the same time they'll be pursuing their own research strategy to get better gear for their own faction. A very important difference though: there should be NO "quick-finish" option. Whatever timers are given to these faction-wide infrastructure investments should be based 100% on game balance, not on creating frustration and pressure to spend RL money on quick-finish. For one thing, since these are actually things that make a faction stronger, it would be blatant P2W if a faction could pay to research faster than its competitors. Any RTS or 4X player will tell you how easy any kind of rush-building is to abuse. This also means that people will have something else to consider when picking their spawn point besides "what's closest to the front?"
That looks like a cool idea, mechanically atleast. However, Lorewise Research and Development is heresy in the 40k universe, things are done because they've always been done that way and even putting different weapons on vehicles is met with huge opposition by the Adeptus Mechanicus and the other Races have had eons to develop their research that a little extra time on a planet won't help that much. Edit after reading the Base Post: Upgrading bases to spawn better variants of certain techs sounds like a cool idea, especially if it takes alot of investment to be able to build vehicles or certain elite/hero classes.
Think of it as the Mechanicus establishing themselves and setting up specialised equipment in certain bases, where there's only so much room for a few. It's not R&D, but accessing equipment you can't just drag onto the front in a battle
Well, it doesn't have to be written as "research" per se, I'm just using the term because it most closely represents how I want the mechanic to function. Narrative-wise it could simply be securing fresh equipment from more prestigious forge worlds instead of using second-hand knockoffs, or obtaining higher-quality STCs with fewer errors in them. But mechanically really it's just a way for an entire faction to make some sort of long-term investment, get a feeling of progression, and then burn each others' long-term investments to the ground.
Great find DJ! I liked pretty much everything I read, and I think it will play out a bit different in Beta than it reads on paper. There are still a lot of unknowns, as far as how it will all tie together. As far as the acquisition of new weapons or "ranking up" to a better weapon.. Not really enough info to tell how this will play out. From what was quoted in the original post. I would think some weapons will be "unlocked" as your progress through the game, those weapons being available in the Chapter Armory aboard your strike cruiser. I'd think other weapons, perhaps better weapons, are found in the game world, or looted off high level opponents. They'll have to be careful with looted weapons though. SM's usually don't loot or use Xenos or Chaos weapons, except during extremely dire circumstances. Where as Orks are all about loot and using every single thing they find. This should be represented in game in some fashion.
There's a lot one could say about this loot box and trading system, but one sentence pretty much sums up the reality of it; why is there trading and loot boxes in a game trying to simulate being "a warrior in the 41st Millenium"? And that's the thing. They shouldn't be. That isn't war in 40k. That's a Rougue Trader RPG. Don't get me wrong, I'd love that... But I'd prefer what EC is trying to be first. First up, since Certifications aren't required for weapons from loot boxes, this potentially means that, combinded with the trading system, it will take a few DAYS for people to trade around to gain access to every unlockable item. If players are rewarded after a fortress/outpost/objective capture with a loot box, the market will fill up insanely quickly, and every player will eventually be able to acquire every thing, without the need to unlock it first. The progression system is basically rendered pointless, and the game has to rely on the fighting as the only source of gameplay, kills variety and sense of unlocking stuff. Not only is there now a dead progression tree, but you have, as others have mentioned, people wasting time trading in the home base, looking for an elusive ultra rare, instead of fighting the war. They are a waste of server space. Furthermore, people will constantly have to pause, open a box, and travel to the vendor and/or drop items into their inventory or the market. Again this detracts form the actual war. Can you imagine a load of orks conquering a fort, a big victory alert popping up, with loot box notification right after. You then see half of the orks go into a "paused" stance, standing around doing nothing as the player rummages through the loot. Pretty silly. The basic point of it is this: This game is about WAR, NOT LOOT. By putting loot in the game, the war becomes a tool to get loot- a game about loot. EC is about WAR. The weapons and equipment are the tools to win the war, not the other way around. What weapon acquisition system should the game use? Simple. There is an unlock tree titled "weapons." In the tree, you have two branches; melee and ranged. The melee branch then has various off-shoots into the various weapons available, while the ranged tree branches into heavy, light, and sidearm categories before going into the actual guns. You spend your earn't XP by buying the nodes in the tree, which allow grant access to more categories, and the base weapons. By levelling up these nodes, you gain access to variants and modifications. Other nodes around the weapons support specialisation, such as reload speed, weapon buck, and load out cost. A system LIKE this, with no trading and loot boxes, is simpler and more rewarding. It gets rid of all the problems I mentioned, and removes the frustration of a random drop. It also allows for progression planning, and stops the "I've got everything so now I'm bored" situation if everyone manages to trade for every item. But most importantly, it rewards DEDICATION and EFFORT, not wasting time sitting at faction home, haggling for items. Sure there is no instant gratification from a mystery box, or "phat loots" but hey, that's what the PvE dungeons are for right? Not only that, the customer knows what the game will give him, so they have more of an incentive to buy a sweet skin to pimp the weapon they have been grinding for; now they have their ideal weapon AND look badass, and the devs have a little more money in their pockets. Everybody wins!
this +1, trading shouldnt be required in EC, loot shouldnt be required in EC...they are unnecessary, and if they do get into EC as the Devs propose at present it will be a shame, but obviously as a fan of 40K and EC I'll still play lol
I think the reason why looting is good is because of Get rare weapons that you dont just 'unlock' randomly Requires that you participate in the game instead of afk'ing and getting Req Trading weapons can help new players out a little Gets players more involved in cooperation in the underworld and raids Sets the game apart from unlock based games like Cod, Battlefield, the standard online game. I do see it being a problem, buts its not like its going to be super hard to implement. Trading could be an issue depending on how it works but its not like it cant work at all. Not every weapon has to be a loot only item, just the rare ones, like relic items. Doesn't even have to be weapons, armor and possibly more progression unlocks would be useful. I'm not saying it has to be in game, but it would be a good thing to have as a reward for doing the underworld or raids.
