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Suicide Bomber Orangutans

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Silfarion, Mar 2, 2017.

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  1. Avlaen Avlaen Arkhona Vanguard

    So LSM need 2 players working together probably with some form of voice coms and its still not as effective as 1 fire dragon.
  2. Lady Rheeva Steam Early Access

    Really? Two people attacking the same target requires voice-communication for you?
    And it is much more powerful than a single Dragon, after all all you need to counter a Dragon is keep driving.

    Both LSM and Eldar have vehicle CC options to keep their prey from escaping, both require at least two players and a minimum of coordination, both can be stopped by a dedicated defender knowing what to do.
    Also, for all four factions, an unguarded tank is easy prey for a player hunting them, ridiculously easy actually, even more so as soon as Eldar get involved for both sides.

    In my experience, a GGMM or HWDFB combo works best in a Warparty if both players know, what they have to do. But if you, yourself, pick the CC-option and announce in chat that you are doing this and where, someone will usually step up for the damage role.
    Or, if someone spawns an AV-transport, you can just join them and spot and hold targets for them.
    Sily likes this.
  3. I think LucianNostra makes some good points here.
    #1) Lascannon is not as fun as meltagun+bomb combo.
    #2) The wave serpents has weak points that I don't think should be there. Regardless of whether or not they should be there, I have historically had a hard time figuring out where exactly to shoot [when not behind], and I don't get many opportunities to practice. Even when I get vs Eldar matches, I usually only get one or two shots before it zooms off with the second one being from behind. I've been around a long time, so I at least know the weak points exist, but what about someone that doesn't even know that much? I think this is an area where a training video could help.
    #3) eldar's ranged anti-tank is not as good as their counterparts, so even if meltabombs+gun are nerfed for all factions, Eldar would possibly need a buff somewhere else to compensate.

    I still agree with Eldritch's solution the most.
    Sily likes this.
  4. Demetri Dominov Demetri_Dominov Arkhona Vanguard

    I'm not really saying anything about the FD in that post, but since you asked.... 2 Meltabombs at roughly a third of the HP as 2 SMs having to work together using medium ranged AV.

    It's hard to really tell honestly. There's quite a few factors since we're comparing apples to oranges.
    Sumshine likes this.
  5. In the end it comes down to assymetrical balance.

    FD only excel against parked vehicles, but parked vehicles are most likely down anyway once an AT unit spotted them. Besides that, Eldar suffer a lot in long range AT compared to other factions.

    I don't think anything about this should be changed. I don't want all factions to play the same in the end! Devs gotta make players move their transports more, then FD's will have a hard time being as good as they are now. To make use of their double MB they would have to stop and block the enemy rhino. I've seen that happen, but it requires a good amount of skill and teamwork to do this (from pilot and FD), and in those cases I think it's justified that the enemy transport goes down.
    Sily likes this.
  6. The main reason to change it is that it's actually in the fire dragons favor to destroy a rhino surrounded passively by 5 people. It's quicker to blow it up than take down the FD. If they had to also get a full blast in, it would be possible to guard the transport. I'm sort of exaggerating but only sort of. This is why no one bothers to guard them. The options are to either keep them moving or let them sit by themselves.
  7. Lerdoc Katitof Well-Known Member

    1) Your comparison is utter bullshit, because in your delusion you seem to be comparing manned skimmer vs abandoned rhino.

    2) Ever heard of Swooping Hawks? Aware of the fact that they are required to counter manned rhinos as they have haywire grenades, allowing Dragon to actually do something to manned and driven vehicle?

    If you pull your head out of your rural area and present equal scenario, Eldar requires 2 players as well for the task, if you lost manned rhino to singular Dragon, please quit the game and play Hello Kitty online or something as you're one of the most hopeless beings around.
  8. Construct_ Thraxus First Blood!


    Haywire Grenades stop vehicles in their tracks to help FD with their task of instant vehicle destruction. And?

    FD does not need a Hawk to destroy a vehicle, all they need is quarter of a second with a stationary, not necessarily unoccupied vehicle and the jobs done in one.

    Also an "Abandoned vehicle" = anything that remains stationary for 0.25 of a second. (So not really abandoned at all) No other faction or AV class can lay claim to that.

    You could be doing a 3 point turn and BAM! An Orangutan jumps out of a tree and your rides done.

    Its toxic, unfair, one sided mechanics like this that make people not want to play the game. Pretty soon that toddler who likes to make up their own rules is sitting alone in the sand pit with no one to play with wondering wtf happened.
    Jimmy_Neutron likes this.
  9. Lerdoc Katitof Well-Known Member

    You have no slightest idea how very sorry I am for your infinitesimal driving skills in this game.
    Apparently I am some kind of godlike divine entity since I am able to avoid dragons myself and never allow them to put a single melta on transports I'm driving around and only time I die is if there are around 4 together trying to fusion gun me down when I do a drive-by.

    Perhaps we should play sometime together, if you promise to keep your madness indulging space corgi flees away from me, I promise to put that L sign on top of rhino and provide you with a wisdom of divinity aka driving lessons for deluded. We will also do behavioral course on Fire Dragons so you'll know what they are actually capable off and what is the creation of your unquestionable paranoia enhanced by utter lack of any EC related skill that would not be spamming fast attack as JPA.

    HELL I'll be super generous and throw in "how to counter skimmers" guide just for you, where I will cover multimelta, grav cannon, lascannon, explain to you in detail how they are not melee weapons and show in theory and practice how you can destroy eldar skimmers quickly without even being on the middle of the road as that is extremely hard subject for LSM players of your caliber, but I'm 100% positive given enough time and tutoring even you will be able to eventually grasp the concept of using correct tools against different kinds of enemies.
    Sily likes this.
  10. Lady Rheeva Steam Early Access

    Is it a coincidence that everything you dont like 'makes people not want to play the game'?
    Or is it maybe projection?
    I would agree with you at anytime that FireDragons have an even easier time than the rest of us taking out vehicles without defense, but saying they can just blow up a Rhino that stopped for a split second is bullcrap and you know it.
    I play Dragon a lot and often with the intention to carry, successfully too, so I know the class is powerful.
    However I also know its limitations and weaknesses and dealing with opponents who actively try to stop me from doing my job is extremely tricky.
    Its not impossible, but it will slow me down to a reasonably level comparable to any other Av-player facing the same opposition.
    The true AV-.superiority is only there if I can do my job undisturbed and uncountered, in any other event I perform approximately the same, sometimes even worse.
    Sily likes this.
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