Background Image

Suggestions For Improving EC

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Pouncey, Mar 12, 2017.

  1. Pouncey Pouncey Subordinate

    Okay, so, here's some things I see as problems the game has, and what I think can be done to resolve them. They aren't in any particular order.

    1. Character progression. I think this is one of the enormous problems that might be being overlooked.

    Eternal Crusade currently uses an unfortunate amount of vertical progression. A fresh, level 1 character is lacking not only options, but power. Horizontal progression is supposed to open up more specialized options, while starting players off with well-rounded options useful for a wide variety of situations.

    Horizontal progression works well when the unlocked weapons are simply more specialized versions of the basic weapon. So you could have a boltgun as the default weapon, then unlock mods that do trade-offs, sacrificing one stat for an increase of another. Having mods that only increase stats without sacrificing anything is not horizontal progression, it is vertical progression.

    Additionally, the not-unlocked weapons are not simply variants of the basic weapon, they are entirely different weapons that do different things. You have to unlock a Reaper Launcher but you start with a Shuriken Cannon. A Reaper Launcher is not a different kind of Shuriken Cannon, it is an entirely different weapon that does different things. The only way to see it as being more a more specialized verson is to look at it in terms of raw statistics and completely ignore the fact that one is a heavy machine gun and the other is a rocket launcher. A much better way to do it would be to have a default version of each weapon available from the start, and then the 'alt' versions would be different in terms of stats.

    To make things worse, virtually all weapon mods and some weapons come from loot boxes that give a random item. This is an incredibly poor way to do these unlocks, because it makes you gamble for the upgrade you want. It would be better to simply allow players to purchase the loot box items directly with Requisition, rather than have players rely on RNG.

    2. RTC shop.

    Eternal Crusade's cash shop is a problem too.

    First, you are selling relic weapons on the cash shop. To a new player, who sees the incredibly ornate-looking weapons, there is an association with cool-looking and power. Because these ornate weapons are only on the cash shop, it creates an impression that these weapons are much more powerful than the ones from Requisition, making the game appear to be pay-to-win. I think you can only solve this by turning the Relic weapons into cosmetic skins, rather than weapons with unique stat profiles. A newbie will not know that these unique stat profiles are merely specialized variants of the default weapons, they will appear much more powerful.

    Second, the quantities of RTC that are purchasable are causing problems because they create an impression of price gouging. This is a psychology thing. Gamers are used to having to buy these kinds of currency in round numbers like 500, 1000, 2000, etc., that correlate to a 100:1 or 1000:1 ratio of currency to dollars, and then the items are priced at numbers that make it so that they always have to buy more currency than they need, by pricing them at irregular values that fall just under the round number.

    Eternal Crusade, on the other hand, has RTC sold in not-round numbers. 4000 RTC and 9000 RTC are the two lowest, as I recall. Yes, 4000 RTC lets you buy two 2000 items, and 9000 RTC lets you buy a 5000 item and two 2000 items, but at this point you have to realize something very, very clear. You are selling RTC in chunks that assume the purchase of multiple items. People who just want a specific 2000 RTC item see the lowest RTC sale of 4000 and see it as twice what they need. People who just want a specific 5000 RTC item see the lowest RTC sale of 4000, just UNDER what they need, and then the next highest is 9000, which is WAY more than they need.

    The system was designed this way to prevent people from having leftover chunks of currency, which is a GOOD way to do it, but the assumption that people will want to have some left over for later is not how people see it. You can fix this by doing two things. First, create RTC sales options for the values of 2000 RTC, 5000 RTC, and 10000 RTC. These correspond to the value of items directly. Have these be the first options on the list. People will see these, and if they only want one item, they will be pleased with this system, since they will see you selling EXACTLY the amount of RTC they want.

    You can still sell those bundles, but you need to include some information with them. You need to have title language referring to them as "bundle" RTC price points, and state outright in the description that the 4000 RTC package is for buying two 2000 RTC items with one transaction, and the 9000 RTC package is for buying one 5000 RTC item and two 2000 RTC items.

    3. In-game statistics.

    Eternal Crusade's statistics are extremely confusing. And they are extremely confusing because there really isn't an explanation for how they affect the character. Toughness, for an example, is a damage resistance stat, but it's difficult to figure out how big a change in Toughness makes. 100 is the default Toughness, and a Toughness mod might being it to 120, which seems like a 20% increase to standard damage reduction, but the part that's not explained is how big of a change that is, because the default damage reduction was not stated in terms of how much it reduces damage taken by. I think what would make it more clear is to show both the absolute Toughness value, and also the percentage of damage reduction that the Toughness value provides.

    Ultimately, a lot of EC's problems boil down to things not really being explained well in-game.
    Korel, Sumshine, RustyRake and 2 others like this.
  2. se05239 Recruit

    The RTC shop costs and the amount of RTC points you buy is one of the biggest gripes I have. Other than the clunky gameplay, horrible melee system, guild-stacked matches, bad optimization and other things from the same list.

    5000 and 10000 would be much better values than 4000 and 9000. It is only done as a scummy technique to make people spend more money than necessary on RTC. There would be less hate if they changed it.
    Matsukovich and JojoKasei like this.
  3. Pouncey Pouncey Subordinate

    No, that's not why they went with 4000 and 9000.

    They went with 4000 because it is the combined price of 2 items that are 2000 RTC each, and 9000 because it is the combined price of 2 items that are 2000 RTC each and 1 that is 5000 RTC.

    They were designing it to try to make sure your RTC would not have annoying amounts left over after a purchase. And they assumed players would just keep any extra in reserve for later. But they didn't really understand how this would look, because they don't really have any staff members who are in-touch with how players think who could tell them it was a bad idea.

    They're just kinda... totally oblivious to how players see things.
  4. Remo RemoSupremo Confessor

    Switch off of doing Mo-Cap animations. That would be my biggest suggestion.

    It will save money and time and allow for greater flexibility in creating new content.

    @NoahWard
    DrDooManiC and Cupcakeunleashed like this.
  5. Git Kwik GitGud Active Member

    mocap is a gimmick. look at how the ork animations turned out. terrible, hopping around like somebody was told to pretend they were a bulky ork model. it should be used for faces and that's about it.

    plus mocap is the gimmick they use to add no thunder/warhammers
  6. Pouncey Pouncey Subordinate

    What animation method would you prefer they use then?

    Also, somebody WAS told to pretend they were a bulky Ork model. Specifically, the actor wearing the motion capture sensors.
  7. Belphegor LordSloth Preacher

    Very solid point, however the vertical progression is not the real issue but a symptom of a lack in progression in general. By hiding most of the mods and weapons behind RNG they stretch existing content to make up for the lack of it. Why put alt weaponskins in boxes - those cosmetic options and feel like a blank every time they come up. The honest answer is that by allowing people to specialize and to select what that want to buy they reach endgame most likely in a 10th of the time. The game does not force you to play anything but the class you desire. So once you have bought all the boltermods (an example if you prefer lets say a tactical) and played a certain amount of games you will have all the needed AP (which are currently also blocked by level requirements to gurantee that you play far more then neccessary to feel some kind of progression). And in all honesty there is nothing EC could offer ontop of rank 6 which would make any sense. Other games offer cosmetic options hidden behind prestige (like the current flavour of the month for honour) but this would starve their RTC store dry and would require them to actually spend money and produce 100s of new vanity/cosmetic items to supplement that. A paragon system would not be healthy either, since a level playingfield is crucial for the long term health of the game. In short: I agree wholeheartly with you but in their current capacity we can only hope for new items trickeling in the existing system and maybe an AP/XP rework once vehicle options or elite classes with their own skilltress etc come in.


    Also 100% with you on this one, the shop should only contain Skins and Cosmetics and clearly state it. I would however wish they would add some kind of booster packs for quicker progression or implement the option to have all the basic weapons already from the get go. If i really wanted my ork to run around with that fancy big shooter skin i wouldn't want to buy it at rank 1 to find out i need to play 3 weeks till i my sacrifice to the RNG-gods paid off and i get the gun from a box to acutally "use" my skin. Otherwise the RTC store becomes a R4-6 players exclusive thing.

    About the RTC values i must say that this is wishfull thinking. They are a profit orientated company afterall. Every game out there tries to maximize their profits by fueling the desire to buy more (because you have some coins left over anyways) unless there is a direct "this skin costs x.x$" realation. And even then european countries often get scammed because of very optimistic exchange rates favouring $ purchases.

    Spot on. Same applies to LP costs in the advancement tree or class limitations on veteran only items or the broken tooltips on many mods. How much damage does a frag do? How much more a krak? Is it worth the 20 LP to lose some trinkets over it? How much armor reg do i have without trinkets etc etc. There are no sums and no white sheet HP or DPS either so newer players can not gauge what the best mods for a powermaul are or if there is even a point in fitting a penetration mod on a powerfist.
  8. Standard rigging using Maya or any equivalent.
    Its far easier to work with and create basic animations that can be altered or adapted for whatever they need to use and can be done in-house without the need for outsourcing.
  9. Pouncey Pouncey Subordinate

    Well, then it's going to cause problems because the way EC does its cash shop purchases is going to and does cause extreme problems because of the specific values. The prevalence of items costing 5000 and 10000 RTC essentially reversed the traditional relationship, which makes it much, MUCH worse. You won't have some coins left over, you will have SHITLOADS of them, and 4 being 1 below 5 and 9 being 1 below 10 is going to infuriate people.
  10. Belphegor LordSloth Preacher

    I know and it gets even worse if you feel you are not getting your moneys worth or that the items seem insanely overpriced. A fully flavoured middle price "ork costume, not including a fancy 10k weapon" without any bundle pieces costs a sporting 31,5k RTC, translating to ~34 euros. For all other factions the prices are as ridiculous. As an example: in LoL i get a custom top priced event skin with completely new grafics, new effects, new voiceovers for around 20 € max. As an ork im even exspected to pay additional 10 euros for the very same pirate hat that i have if i want another small emblem or knive at the front, rebuy value 0. Other games like Dreadnought offer very cheap starter cosmetics which are basically recolors of some sort and escalate their price scheme towards really cool stuff. EC is (orks as an example) forcing you to buy crappy stuff because the default skin is so ugly. Asymetrical teeth, all green and brown and gobs give you a silly metal bathing cap. Dentist job (if you ever run without a gob) 3 euros. Same applies to the other factions apart from LSM. Eldar add insult to injury, barely having any cosmetics and those which are there are recolours for 10k or mild modifications, warlock helmet "branches" having different angles and size anyone? Or to mention CSM, what is the point buying cool demon shoulders, and matching torso for 22 euros if backpack, legs and helmet are missing and the current tier armor adds some glitchy taint to it? You would think they would release fully matching sets for people.

    Not to mention there is literally no point in cosmetics since the game offers you no "modelling stage" to even present them. A stalker tactical, Hawk or heavy weapons guy could wear a clowns costume and noone would ever see bar your own teammates for the 10 seconds you spawn or run away. This gets even worse on fortress maps or in narrow points where everyone hides behind cover and just pokes out to shoot. If there was an MVP area after the matches where you could show off your cool stuff, or if there was a guildhall or a working multifaction garrison/city it would make sense. But to spend top dollar on something hardly anyone will ever see or appreciate is not really engaging- especially since multiple costumes bought for your own amusement are not a thing either - as you can only view one loadout in your own "staging screen" at a time. So you cant appreciate your own goods either. Not to mention that the low TTK and the range combat format make admiring the guys costume who shot you or who got shot by you an eye blink operation. Maybe im overly negative but i never bothered to check if he was wearing mark III or mark V pants.

    The only time i actually inspected someones costume and thought "cool looking", until i checked the pricetag for it mind you, was when i was guarding a point and nothing happened for what felt like 10 minutes and the only other guy covering next to me spend those 40+ euros for a full set with matching gun.

Share This Page