Seeing as the last thread on the subject died off a few months ago and the search engine failed to detect any recent ones, I believe it's time to restart discussion on this interesting part of the roadmap. This thread's purpose is to discuss potential traits and unique classes based on the tabletop and lore for the confirmed sub-factions as well as those that have lost previous votes or weren't options if you so desire.

But first, some rules to (hopefully) ensure civilized discussion:

• No recruitment.
• No sub-faction taunting, I don't want to read about Imperial Fists having extra penetration with power fists or Wardmarines having void shields.
• Keep the suggestions reasonable, the devs have stated that sub-factions won't have drastic changes from each other besides a few unique units and wargear where applicable.

EDIT: All races welcome.

Well, looking at their chapter tactics in the codex and at their skill in siege warfare, I think the Imperial Fists would do extra damage with explosive weaponry such as grenades, Rocket Launchers and Vindicator cannons, based on their affinity with siege warfare.

In terms of unique equipment, perhaps they could get boarding shields as cheaper and lower level versions of storm shields for their assault and tactical marines, providing them with a heavy defensive bonus to support the vanguard of a Space Marine assault, but at the expense of a decent close combat weapon.

These two would compliment the Imperial Fists' reputation for siege warfare, their skill as spacefaring boarding parties, and their ability to use defensive tactics in an assault, which sums them up perfectly.

The first option you presented would be a good translation of the Tank Hunters rule in TT, making it easier to bring down enemy structures like gates and turrets.

The second, while also fluffy, has the potential of giving IF too much of an advantage over other sub-factions as it affects the core group of weapons that forms the backbone of both space marine factions.

I agree entirely. I've removed it and I think I'll stick with the explosives. What do you think of the boarding shields idea?

Would be nice depending on what classes can use it. Lore-wise both tacticals and assaults use it. In EC we know that assaults can exchange their jump-packs for Storm Shields and the same is likely to happen with combat shields if the devs remember they exist, though I'd love if the latter could be equipped on tacticals as well.

For Ultramarines, certain Heroes could have the paired Gladius and dagger-like weapon that their Champions use. That would be cool for a melee character, who wants a bit of parrying alongside two melee weapons.

Blood Angels could use the Glaives Encarmine I guess, but I don't see how they'd work differently from other Power Weapons. The Golden Facemasks of Fear would be cool too, turning them into sort-of-Banshees. For traits, a passive trait that increases melee speed for each kill would be kinda fluffy, too.

Space Wolves could easily get some sort of boost to their wargear through unqiue runes maybe? Not much of af Wolves fan, can't help there :/

Dark Angels might want to have some sort of trait that allows faster cooldown of Plasma maybe... I also expect them to have some truly nasty duelist-like heroes in the form of Chaplains and so forth.

I'm really hoping that bEhaviour doesn't translate the Ultramarines being strict to the codex as them having minimal customisation capacity. They have such a unique aesthetic and demeanour about them and it definitely needs to be present in the game.

The Ultramarines' gladius is iconic and renowned to their Chapter, and there is so much room to play with in making it look awesome. The film wasn't a booming success, but a lot of their artwork was sublime.



I would really love to see their Great Crusade era culture trickle down into their current state as well. What comes to mind is a certain scene in the novel The Betrayer, where the Ultramarines use a certain military formation that harkens to their Roman inspiration.



Their appearance, mainly for veterans, but in an obviously trimmed down way for Battle Brothers, is unmistakeable.



The helmet plumes, the cloaks and capes (although I've heard this will be difficult from a technical perspective), the Aquila heraldry, the lorica segmentata, the pteruges, the classical era helmet designs.




Let's not forget the Honour Guard:



And the Tyrannic war veterans:



The truth is they have so much more going for them than the plain 'vanilla' marines that so many people ignorantly mistake them for in their haste to join the hate bandwagon.

Their potential for customisation is as rich and diverse as any other Chapter and this needs to be reflected.

As for their unique faction traits.

It would be very interesting to see them have squad based traits. Boons and buffs that encouraged teamwork and formation adherence, so as to reflect their learning and codex conduct. This might be somewhat complex however, as it would need to be more intricate than simply a benefit from numbers in proximity.

We know them to be the jacks of all trades in a manner of speaking (barring their very specialised Tyrannic war veterans). They are familiar with all forms of combat but specialise in none. They aren't the close combat experts of the Blood Angels, or the ranged veterans of the Dark Angels. Their training is more comprehensive but as a result, less in-depth. How could we represent that with in-game mechanics I wonder?

I agree with all this, there's just one thing I'd really want to change about apperance.

Way too many models of the Ultramarines, especially the Honour Guard, has the logo all over the models, which is nothing different from the other Chapters, but the Ultramarines can hardly deviate on how to make their symbol stand out. The Blood Angels can add wings, have different colours on the blood, Dark Angels has the "dark statue" thing and wings and a lot else - Ultramarines has the Omega, but only that. No wings, heraldry or colour change, just a whole lot of Omegas.

Please, differentiate the logo a bit. I don't want my Ultra to be plastered in the same icon over and over

I think that the traits will not influence too much the vehicles (maybe a discount for certains vehicles could work though), also the different traits should confere advantages only in definite occasions.
For exhample, they could give to the Imperial Fists less recoil while shooting from both cover and the devastator "turret" position we have seen in game, maybe even shortening the time to switch in that position.
For Iron hands, more suppression resistance, and maybe even a little (max 10%) resistance to non-antiarmour weapons damage (basically bolters, sluggas and shuriken) and if that result too op they could counter it with giving them less resistance against plasma and similar weapons (that are effective on armour and mechanical targets in general, max 8%).
For Raven Guard, they have mentioned the possibility for silenced weapons and jetpacks, and the possibility to hang from walls, also they could have a precision bonus on the first hit while not seen by the enemy.
For Blood Angels instead a bonus damage for charging and a more powerful push (reduce enemy stamina while parring, max 10% more) with charged melee attacks.
Maybe they could even add unique abilities for elite classes (different abilities for librarians chapters would be very cool!) or unique elites as well (black company for Blood Angels, shadow masters for Raven Guard, pyroclasts for Salamanders, warp talons for Night Lords, flash gitz for Evil Sunz and so on).
And yeah, obviously some unique weapons/equipments for every subfactions are a must.

I'm glad to be able to show you that the variety you are talking about does in fact exist for the Ultramarines logo.

We of course have the standard inverted omega, or the stylised 'U'. However it comes with a variety of embellishments.

This is best displayed perhaps on their banners.



We have the inclusion of a skull or Aquila superimposed over or 'inside' of the 'U'. There is the very characteristic laurel wreath. Also a fuller and more ostentatious depiction of the Imperial Aquila.

One of my favourite iterations is with the sword pointing down through the emblem, seen on the chest of these warriors.


In the following picture we can see an array of devices, from that of the newly elevated Battle Brother, through the veteran and to the Captain. Just look at the sheer amount of variation on the emblems of Sidonus (warrior on the left). From his chest downwards to his knee there are so many examples of how the stylised 'U' logo of the Ultramarines can and is subject to deviation.



So as you can see, they lack no variation in this regard either.