I think we're approaching this from fairly similar positions. Obviously, it depends on the MMO (not every MMO is a tab-targeting MMORPG), but the point was that in games where healing is hugely influential it completely transforms TTK and the entire way the game flows. I'm not a huge fan of the outcome it tends to deliver.

The PS2 model isn't a bad one to use as a starting point, but I personally think we need to get away from "you need a medic to heal anything at all", as again, it raises medics up into a position that's just too critical, and which no-one else can cover. Being the only class capable of in-combat healing is absolutely fine, but removing health regen entirely to enforce reliance on medics at all times would be a step too far, IMO.

Warframe has a pretty cool system. You get 20 seconds (IIRC), more if you have appropriate upgrades, of bleeding time before you died. Anyone could revive in about 6 seconds. And if there was combat going on, you could prevent the timer from going down fast while still fighting even if you couldn't revive yet.

The guy bleeding could crawl and fire a secondary weapon (pistol) but not much else, not even capable of reload.

Just an example, I don't think it would work best for EC though.
What I would like is that any class can prevent bleeding to death on a fallen comrade, but only ones with certain equipment could revive. I would say that any class could get such equipment but others have better access to them (such as an apothecary or a warlock). It would take space in the load-outs though (less space with classes more specialized in support), so it wouldn't be a mandatory purchase for everyone in case they want something else.
And if someone does have medical equipment, it should be seen easily by other players, in case they need help.
The downed person could also maybe do a "cry for help" which would maybe give a waypoint for other players to see.

As far as instant death goes, I would say it should be possible and not that rare either. Every time you fall there should be a small chance (5-20% depending on weapon maybe) of just dying instantly without a chance of revival/execution if you are struck hard enough. If it is a lascannon to the face, there should be really small chances of not getting instantly killed.


Lastly, I think it would be nice if there is no medic around, someone could "end the suffering" of a friend in case he is just stopped from bleeding but no one is around to revive. It could give a small amount of points for something. To prevent any "farming" on killing friendlies this way there should be a greater reward if someone you bandaged/prevented bleeding is revived by another person.

I agree on the suggestion that downed state should be removed. However, I don't think that will happen considering how much the devs wants executions in the game. You need the downed state to complete the execution system, should we remove executions aswell? Well it's not a core aspect in terms of making the gameplay work. I would not have a problem with removing that feature if it means there won't be a downed state even thou executions are pretty cool.

I like the idea of Orks being able to revive themselves a limited number of times. There is some lore on Orks popping back up even after your sure you killed them.

What's wrong with the downed state? You don't NEED to use it, you can just pump a couple extra shots into any downed opponent, no muss, no fuss, no +100 EXP. Taking it out of the game removes a nicely balanced risk/reward situation and eliminates executions as well.

I'm just not seeing the huge negative that would necessitate it's removal.

T

That bit of lore refers to how they reproduce, and thats by spores cause they are mushrooms. Thats why you cant ever really exterminate them cause each time you kill one it seeds more spores that will in time regrow the Ork swarm.
But its not an instant process by no means so that tidbit of lore cannot have any relation to the downed state.

I remember reading about that as well. Where they burn ork bodies to try and prevent spores. It is also mentioned a few times that Orks will take tremendous amounts of punishment and have a bad habit of getting back up after taking wounds that should have killed them.

I know its in a couple of Sandy Mitchell's books. I want to say I've read it in others, but I can't remember which ones.

There was one thing about death in GW2 which I liked; the Warrior's downed ability of Vengeance. It basically allowed them to rally (i. e. get up) and fight for a few more seconds before dying for reals, no downed state. There is a small chance to rally during Vengeance, but I don't care for that right now (before anyone corrects me).

I think some classes... elite classes, like... a Khorne Berzerker, or 'ard Nobz (if something like that exists), or a Nurgle Champion or... I honestly can't think of more elite classes (giving it to a normal class would be overkill), for those classes it could make sense to give them an ability similar to that, that allows them to self-rez and fight on for... maybe 10 seconds, melee-only, maybe with a defense buff, before falling down and having to respawn. If used sparingly, it could be a nice addition.

AFAIK, something similar is implemented in the Deathwatch FFG P&P, where a supposedly dead character can make some kind of last stand, burning all his Fate points and getting an intense buff, but I haven't played Deathwatch yet, so I don't know for sure.

I absolutely hate his system only because ive seen it dozens of times. had already covered it in My thread Its Some injuries players should not (incapacitated) by. Shot in the head from a high caliber weapon, well in theory there's no more head in that spot....so how the hell are you getting back up? Hit with a High Explosive round from a tank? There should be a pile of Gib laying there, not a player in need of a helping hand lol.

It's all about the Whaaagh and their psychic connection that if they believe something to be true with enough orkz believing the same thing it is.

So an individual ork that takes a mortal wound simply dies, an ork surrounded by hundreds of orkz that think they are invincible can have his limbs blown off, scoop his guts up with one hand and still swing his choppa. When the Maddok comes along he doesn't need to know much only really believe that by stapling the orkz legs back on with rusty bolts is going to work just fine.