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Putting the Grim and Dark back into EC

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Schwifty, Jul 9, 2018.

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  1. The Problem with "Getting gunned down in Melee Combat" is especially relevant once you talk anything faster then a sword. Maybe it's just my latency, but it feels like Tactical & Equivalents can take a good sip of tea before they frag me when i am not even through my 2nd swing animation and that's annoying.
    (Unless of course i roll round like sonic the hedgehog and use roll-attacks all day long)

    Either speed up the animations and make those weapons just more expensive for their better clang & Damage, or add some kind of damage mitigation while in combat. My 2 cents
  2. The only think I seriously don't like about melee is *brace for typical me* tacticals continuously rolling/rollexing away and shooting before you can get to them until you die without even touching them (but then again, that is only if flanking failed), and using your pistol is useless as you'll die faster than they will and won't be using your main weapon, which would stop them shooting
  3. Mauf DrMauf Subordinate

    It's due to how Knife/Pistol behaves for tacticals. You kinda have to do that rollex shite (or lure the melee into a clever wall hit) or you're practically dead.

    It's been long discussed but: Remove the durability loss on winning a proper melee RPS, you do the right thing, don't get punished for it. That still leaves the advantage to melee but gives the tac somewhat of a chance. Second, force a weapon switch for ranged the moment you use a melee type attack, requiring you to weapon switch back to the main weapon (AND BY THE CHAOS GODS DON'T DO THIS UNLESS YOU REMOVE THE DURABILITY LOSS ON WINNING A CLASH), so you can't rifle whip from Dbash. Third, try a slight speedup of clang animations so the melee movement lock becomes less of a problem.

    My suggestions on the topic. Game right now is too much on a razor's edge when it comes to melee/ranged. We need to broaden that edge and that means both melee and ranged have to give away some advantages and recieve some in return.
  4. Despite that niggling little unsubstantiated and counter constructive comment at the end there. Not quite sure what that's about but aside from that the rest are all very good points. Sometimes its hard to find a place to start with what's wrong with melee because there's so much that's wrong.

    There's almost certainly boatloads more than that to add but there's also probably no reason to go on about it because it's all been talked about before, its all known and out there, the devs know and have given no indication of actually changing them for the better. In short nothing's changed so far why would anything change in the future.
  5. Teef Trooper909 Recruit

    Melee will never be in a good place because only pure bolter players have the devs ear and are also the majority.If anything expect more melee nerfs in the future probably Dbash.
  6. Eagle 11 Eagle_11 Well-Known Member

    How to fix EC melee: increase plasma pistol total ammo count.
  7. Sad but true ^

    Maybe if enough of us talk about it as if it were not true some quantum entangled universal consciousness will take that into account and slowly begin to weave it into reality.

    How to fix Melee? make Pistols better. Hmmm bit of an oxymoron there.

    I hate myself for resorting to Pistol over primary weapon but its what you gotta do to survive in a game where melee was an after thought in development.
  8. Antheus Fiendly Confessor

    I'd just like to point out the damage mitigation by itself wasn't the problem back in alpha.

    Back in time, you indeed had damage mitigation, but it was on top of native lifesteal and greatly reduced stamina/fuel regen. And it's the mix of these 3 that made the melee what is was.

    And then suddenly, all these 3 aspects got removed at once, and since then, melee is a struggle/underperforming for most players.

    Obviously getting stamina/fuel regen to where it was would be broken as it used to be especially since compared to the alpha, we now have wargear to buff this aspect.

    To me native lifesteal would be but a bandage on an open wound and wouldn't change much in the end.

    But damage mitigation I believe could be a way to investigate in order to find a decent value according to your OP. Tho in the end, it would be a lot of work and investigation, the kind of ressources currently lacking from bE.

    What could be done more "easily" tho, would be to give all the melee classes kinda the same mechanic as Banshees, and upon use would mitigate n% damage for a short duration, probably somewhere between 3-5 seconds if you ask me. The mechanic in itself is already present in the game, it's "just" about a timer and a stat increase.

    The Banshee would/could benefit from it too, but maybe with a reduced % compared to other classes since you got the debuff already.

    If you ask me in the end, any class at all could benefit from it, tho at a different strenght and duration according to the different classes, with a prioritization being like :

    Ground Assaults >= Jump Packs > Heavy > Tacs > Healers
    JojoKasei and DrMauf like this.
  9. Mauf DrMauf Subordinate

    That wouldn't help with what I describe as the "on razor's edge balancing". Melee at range has too little options, ranged in melee has too little options (except clever use of game mechanics like rollex, the actual reason it's such a hot topic to begin with). Your suggestion would only shift everything a bit. What needs to happen is that at the same time, melee get more survivability at range to close the gap while ranged get more standing power in melee so they don't have to resort to 'clever use of game mechanics'. All the while the self-lock down due to melee animations needs to be addressed (completely movement unlock or fasten up, needs to be tried I guess).
    I personally would be interested to see how a movement unlock (even if it means shuffle sliding due to lacking animations) would play out since that would allow melees to put their opponents between them and other foes, negating the 'shooting into melee locked players' problem altogether.
    JojoKasei and BrotherDamnatus like this.
  10. Sprint should still be suppressed while in melee animation, but besides that I'd love to see that. It would also enable ranged classes to disengage from melee by using the environment much better.
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