We don t need meely damage nerf. It could be same. But for that burst damage melee should pay with stats. Melee can t have same amount of armor and thoghtness coz range weapon does less damage thats why melee can easely run towards shooting gun. Especially JPA classes - flying tanks thats really cool. But they allready has burst damage, unexpected attack from the sky and escape mechanics + they got they got same stats as tactics.... REALLY ? Classes should pay for advantages they got.AND there is no difference between GA and JPA , GA has to be a tank class and JPA a specops class who enters the combat unexpected. Now a days GA and JPA are tank classes and JPA are even better than GA. But who cares take 20 armor and stfu. Plasma Canon is not so OP, we just got lots of brainless JPA who is always in the midle of the fight tanking tactics and team8ts. Plasma Cannon is the only weapon wich helps to deal with melee zergs.But can be easely controlled with JPA or any tactic who can think and flang the devostator.
Loadouts : Loadouts currently have one problem : you can choose every options (raw power, tactical power, survivability power) at the same time, and those multiples options got their power nerf to balance it. It would rather have way pricier items that would sacrifice 2 options for a full one. Classes : Limitating classes is refused by the community and the devs, and isn't a good answer to balance issues. Melta : Add one more melta load to kill a vehicle, it will be enough. Ranged vs melee : The only thing I see to help ranged classes is to remove the current mechanic that makes you loose durability even if you apply the right counter : you loose less durability but you still loose some. Otherwise this particular issue is fine : Suicide bombing : remove the possibility to make a grenade explode when hit. (I do like this option though.) Vehicles need some love indeed.
Putting limit on class choices won't solve anything. Instead it will introduce a lot of other problems. Like newbies occupying specialist slots an you loosing due to that. Or simply nobody spawning as heavy support because all people lack tokens. Or number of support players being inadequate to task at hand. It's totally fine for everyone able to spawn as Devastator, it's naturally solved by properly balancing classes so players are incetivized to diversify their strike force. You see melee and PC spam simply because they are OP. The moment they are put in line, Melee and Devastator population will naturally shrink.
If they actually boosted the ranged weapons to actually kill people, players wouldn't need to resort to the cheese stuff like Plasma melee etc.. P.s. Melta's crap too.
I figured id expand on this since the concept of "Limiting class choices" since that phrase seems to invoke the same worry and concern with players. When I suggest this as an idea, I do NOT mean the following: Only 5 people can play Heavy Weapons, only 2 people can play medics, only 10 people can play melee This is NOT a good way of handling things. So please dont immediately get fearful or defensive when I mention "class limits". What Im suggesting, is more of limiting how OFTEN specific classes can be played, specific to EACH player. Every player will have the same opportunity to play every class the set number of times, regardless of what other players are playing. This removes the "What if a noob picks one of the limited medic slots" issue. The way it would work is this: (these numbers are purely for example, and are in no way actually balanced) (#3 is an alternative method, so if #1 still bothers you, keep reading!) 1. Every player, when they join a match, will have the ability to pick ANY class. However, some classes will be limited in the number of times that you as a player can spawn as them. For example, the base Tactical Marine, the staple of the LSM army, will have an unlimited number of times that you can spawn as. Devastators on the other hand, a more specialized class, you might only be able to pick and spawn at total of 5 times during a match (again, 5 is purely a place holder. 10 may be deemed more balanced, or 2 for that matter. Testing would be required) By placing individual (per player) spawn limits on specialized classes, it adds elements of strategy and tactics to the game. It means you would want to save your ability to spawn as a Devastator for those times when it makes most sense. If the entire team desired, they could all spawn in the start of the match as Devastators (which might work great for a defensive style map). Once a player used up all their personal spawn counts for a class, they wouldnt be able to spawn as that class until the map was over. This system doesnt keep players from playing classes they like, it does however keep matches from being irreversibly unbalanced from specialized classes existing in excessive numbers throughout the ENTIRE match, while still allowing people to play those classes throughout the match. 2. Objective incentives to benefit the entire team. Any time an objective is captured, the entire team would get an additional spawn of each specialized class added to their spawn counter. This would be seen like calling in reinforcements, allowing more specialized units to spawn in, even if players had used up all their times spawning as them. 3. An alternative to the limited spawn counts, specialized units, on a per player basis, could have spawn cooldowns similar to vehicles. Meaning anyone could spawn as a devastator, but after they die, there would be a 90 second cooldown before they could pick this class again. Each specialized class would have a different cooldown, with the base Tactical Ranged Marine having no cooldown outside of the normal respawn wait. When your team captures an objective, it could reset these spawn timers for the entire team (again symbolizing reinforcements.) Both of these methods would reduce the amount of specialized classes on the battlefield from being a 100% constantly there situation, to a more situational and spread out occurrence. It would would much more diversify the types of classes on the field at any given time, moving the game away from what it is now (such as 80% of a team being melee the entire game.) Anyway, there you have it. I feel this would benefit the game overall. Helping with overall balance, and diversity for the game. People wouldnt scream about melee being OP because melee wouldnt dominate the map in numbers. Melta rushes wouldnt be a thing because either a cooldown or spawn count would limit how frequently it could happen. Plasma spam would also be reduced. IE: All these "OP" issues would simmer down, and NOTHING would actually need to be nerfed.
From my experience playing chaos and orks last night it appears that many of the strong attacks have had their attack distance reduced significantly. I was hitting air on my powerfist regularly where before the patch i would've definitely connected. I haven't tried out ever weapon type but i think modifying attack ranges is a much better fix for melee than buffing ranged damage. It shouldn't be easy for a dedicated ranged class to escape a dedicated melee class but it should be possible. Currently it's possible for all the tacticals classes to do it but it is the rare individual who actually accomplishes it. Melee can't be an easy thing to balance - 1 on 1 melee seems OP a lot of times. Run into a room as melee with two gunners and you're dead in seconds and they're most likely fine unless you're a JPA and can surprise them or have a shield. Ranged classes benefit a lot more from sticking with groups while melee can solo a lot easier. That in itself means pugs will have more success as melee classes most of the time. Too many changes though and melee will quickly become obsolete. If it becomes too easy to escape a melee class you will quickly see people stop using them. If you haven't killed someone after a dash attack and two follow-ups you're going to get attacked by their teammates and probably die anyway. tl/dr - I think we're getting pretty close to balanced here. Minor adjustments can make a large difference so let's not do anything too drastic.
I see problems with that approach, such as: - This system does not prevent entire team initially spawning as Devastators and as such gaining initial advantage they build their game on. Plus, this system relies on player dying X times before restriction takes effect. With experienced players it can be greatly mitigated or avoided entirely. - Some players prefer to play a certain role, but this system forbids them to do so, as lucky enemy action results in player dead and unable to play his favorite class for 1 life or for entire remainder of match. Not to mention it severely undermines warparties where roles are assigned beforehand.
As always NO. to class limits. How can you think 2 Players getting to play with the OP stuff is better, then bringing the OP stuff in line, and letting everyone play with balanced weapons? Edit: and this is basically the concept of Veteran classes. So what you want is, instead of balancing them to be normal classes, you just want to make them a veteran class?
