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Making Defense Feel Impactful/rewarding

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Rasako, Dec 2, 2013.

  1. Etherion Etherion Subordinate

    Personally, if I were designing a stronghold, either it would be defensible everywhere, or there'd be one "weak" point that is actually a giant and extremely nasty trap. So, it can be effectively defended against all directions. It doesn't make sense for there to be one giant hole in the defenses, unless the attackers made it themselves. And it isn't necessary to force players to follow the same path to take a base every time. That just makes people bored of the game sooner.
  2. highs2lows highs2lows Subordinate

    I think that base sitting is actually something that should be encouraged by points. defending a base is Critcal when there is a whole planet at stake.
  3. Etherion Etherion Subordinate

    Base sitting should be encouraged. And attackers should be rewarded if they find a completely undefended base. You and some buddies find an empty castle? It's your castle, at least until the old occupants come home. I think it would be fair to include some NPC guards, depending on how much the defenders are willing to pay in requisition, but bad strategy should not be encouraged by the devs.
    highs2lows likes this.
  4. Whiskey Whiskey Subordinate

    Hope you weren't looking for an argument on that. They needed a lot more BETA time, 4 - 5 months is being generous, and they needed to listen to the people that said back then: Giant TDM is still just tdm, it gets boring, add more diversity, make support roles really matter etc etc. But they didn't listen and it ended up being a boring game.

    But enough about that junk, I have high opes for EC and thus far it has been head and shoulders above anything else I have been a part of. Game wise.
    Partisan likes this.
  5. DroppMan Active Member

    Staying alive preventing respawns within a radius if you stay in the base? Defending against the odds for x time granting an aura of some sort? or respawn boosts? essentially becoming "hero of bastion primus AD7995c3b"
  6. Luciasar Luciasar Well-Known Member

    I'm guessing neither of you have ever played planetside 2. Base squatting isn't strategic, it's pointless. It's work that in most games and real conflicts is delegated to guards, not the elite shock troops players will represent. Base sitting means hopping around and listening to 13 year olds jabber on the comms, and that one guy playing miley cirus at top volume through his mike. Base sitting means 10 min to half an hour of doing absolutely jack before moving along with the zerg to the next base, because no army that values its skin is going to come over and bother your mass of players squatting on the point waiting for it to turn. Maybe you'll get sniped once or twice by some opportunistic infiltrator, but that's it.

    And squatting on an empty point is even better: it's called ghost capping, and that's what the pugs (pick up gamers) too lazy to actually fight like to do. It occurs when the boredom of pointsquatting overcomes even the most hardcore of the zerg and they move along to try and find something useful to do, leaving empty points open for the stragglers to bicker over. Dealing with ghostcappers is pointless and frustrating for outfits, because you have to spend disproportionate resources and manpower ratting them out, and they're typically the type of spineless player that will take off as soon as they see they cant win easily anyway. And as soon as you leave, they come back. Again and again.

    Sorry to be harsh, guys, but I personally have no tolerance for that kind of gameplay. As far as I'm concerned it's what ended PS2 for me. I want a dynamic front for shock troops to battle over, a real war of escalation, not a series of points for zergs and ghostcappers. Have defense be worthwhile on its own merits. Don't enforce it arbitrarily.
    GodEmperorTitus and Whiskey like this.
  7. Etherion Etherion Subordinate

    I thought we established that this game should be nothing like PS2? And you're right, base sitting in PS2 is pointless. Because you can spawn at bases. If you couldn't, you'd need defenders before the attackers arrive. And you don't necessarily need to sit in a base for hours, but if you see an enemy army, reinforce whatever is in its way.
    highs2lows likes this.
  8. Luciasar Luciasar Well-Known Member

    Apologies. In these longer threads I usually don't expect people to have read everything; I'd assumed we'd regressed to the assumption of bases as spawn locations.

    But I stand by the argument that defense should be on its own merits. When you set up a player-created forward operating base, especially one that's close to the frontline and is particularly risky, you defend the crap out of it. Nobody has to tell you to; you're doing it because you want it to survive. Bases should be the same - you defend because you want those advantages and because it's under threat. Empty bases that you don't need shouldn't require human guards - leave that to NPCs.
  9. Etherion Etherion Subordinate

    My point was that undefended bases should be easily taken, and high risk bases should be defended. I'm not suggesting forcing anyone to do anything. A good offense to keep an enemy staggered could be just as effective as a good defense. But if you have no defense, don't be surprised if you start losing bases.
    Also, of you read through the thread, you'll notice I've been posting since the first couple pages.
    Whiskey and luciasar00 like this.
  10. Bob Well-Known Member

    Always remember that you are a pug to somebody else.

    Which is entirely the point of certain types of operations and warfare.

    I agree, undefended bases should be captured quickly.
    A concern I have is the construction/destruction of fortifications and whatnot. Can I use demo charges at any point along an enemy fortification or only a specific points? Can I just flat out destroy the base and move on? Can I collapse a structure or wall onto enemy defenders, killing or at least rendering them combat ineffective?

    How a base/FOB/COP/trench/bunker/whatever is defended will largely be determined by how it can be attacked.

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