Space marines don't have scouts, and it'd hardly make sense to make the recruits elites (since kommodo's are going to apparently be elite). So I suggest that each faction get's a stealth class. Space marines can get scouts, orks kommando's...Eldar already have striking scorpions, but you could give them Rangers, which would also give them a sniper to boot. And as for chaos, you could have cultist/mutant (I say mutant as then you could justify them being as tough as a scout). They could have stealth capabilities, and perhaps be more mobile, but lose out on durability (Scouts/mutants not plodding around in power armour, kommando's not so tough as the other boyz since they don't get punched as often, and rangers...Well, their ponsy eldar who learned how to be sneaky, not to be able to absorb bullets better), and not have the wide weapon section tacticals and their equivelents have, just to give tact's something over them. Their could still be elite versions that have all their special stuff, but it'd still be nice to have regular scouts and their equivelents. EDIT: We have discussed that as opposed to stealth being going invisible, these 'stealth' classes could be more of skirmishers - classes specialising in hit and run tactics, able to move and position easier and with greater effectiveness, but lose out on the firepower and toughness the other classes would get.
I think this is at least good grounds to discuss sub-factional uniqueness. I'm not sure scouts are really an option here. As a base class, I feel there would be too many of them in a match such that it would defeat the flavour of the marine faction. Obviously they can't be an elite class due to the fact that they are troops normally and come packing even less armour than a tactical marine does. However, I think Alpha Legion deserve some sort of stealth mechanic somewhere in their arsenal. This is kinda their thing. I think all the other sub-factions should get specific mechanics of their own, but Alpha Legion definitely deserve something like stealth. Could just be a weaker version of the scorpion stealth so that they are faded when stationary. Rangers as a base class is a definite yes from me. It would definitely help eldar to have some snipers.
As elites sure but not base classes, Scorpion is already a worthless class and giving stealth classes with guns or more than Chainswords would kill the class. I know Rangers (our meh troop that is now elite locked) and Kommandos should have stealth and so Scouts could work if elites as well, my problem is would they be worth it over Termies or Wraithguard.
I have no idea why you'd think it'd defeat the flavour of them. I'm trying to think of how you came to that, but I just can't comprehend why. Explain, if you would. Like I pointed out, the stealth classes would have less then what a tactical/ground assault can get. You wouldn't be able to get a power sword as a scout, the most you could get is a chainsword or boltgun, maybe a shotgun if they put them in, so they'd be on equal footing. And since elites are stuff like terminators, make them a base class. And no, scouts can't work as elites, as scouts are what a space marine starts as, so that would be utterly ridiclous. Their are scout sergeants, but they can be veterans.
Go learn "asymmetric balance" phrase and the meaning of it. You have power fists and 100 weapons for each class, we have stealth. Also, you can have stealth when dragons melta will have grav effect again.
Give eldar more stuff then. They need more junk any way. Give the factions all the same oppourtunities. Sure, you can have differenes, but still let them do it and don't restrict stuff to races/factions. Because that sucks. I don't like Eldar, but if I want stealth, at the moment their the only ones with stealth, and that sucks for me. Similiary, since everyone else has stuff like powerfists and other smackers, give an equivelent to Eldar. Equivelents probably exist somewhere. Same goes for other weapons - if space marines have a stalker boltgun, give eldar rangers with their sniper rifle thing. Give chaos/orks an equivelent too. (Honestly, I think they should of gone with Tau as opposed to eldar. More weapon variety, and makes more sense for them to be in open conflict as opposed to eldar)
SO you can have chainswords, boltguns or shotguns and even snipers and plasma pistols but our class only gets chainswords? already better than our secondary GA. This is why Elite only, like the other factions, our Sniper Ranger will be elite locked so should Scouts who can also get snipers, its just isn't fair to the race who has the mechanic because we don't get Jump melee and you want that advantage because you don't have it, its like asking all of our Hawks to get power weapons because everyone has them. You can't have everything while everyone else gets limits, our Rangers are weaker scouts so why do we get elite locked and you should have the better and more versatile version as a troop? and why should some of our versions of Marine weapons be elite locked? it's awfully unfair to the other players when LSM demands everything and gets you know.
Well..... I think the point is that the stealth is a unique feature to the Eldar Striking Scorpion, and will be something accessible by other factions. Eldar are very specialised compared to the other factions, and (Currently) the Scorpion can't get anything better than a Chainsword and shuriken/fusion pistol (The latter being useless). This changes a LOT when you have scouts running around with bolters, plasma guns, etc. Kommandos are also an elite Ork thing. They've never been basic troops. Scouts would far outshine the Scorpions in usefulness and effectiveness, and would just further crush the other factions under the Marines' boots. Before proposed change: Basic Stealth Class : Elite Stealth Class LSM- N/A : Scout sgt. CSM- N/A : N/A Orks- N/A : Kommando Eldar- SS : Ranger After proposed change: Basic Stealth Class : Elite Stealth Class LSM- Scout : Scout sgt. CSM- Mutant : N/A Orks- Kommando : Kommando Eldar- SS : Ranger I think making every faction capable of stealth regardless of subfaction, would just fill the game with stealth classes, and the Striking Scorpion wouldn't even have a use, because the other stealth classes just destroy it. Basic stealth classes should be restricted by subfaction, and forced to take less effective weapons. I have a suggestion for if we really do end up spreading stealth around (Which I vote against.) Suggestion: Basic Stealth Class LSM- Dark Angels (+1 class, scout.) CSM- Alpha Legion (Stealth item, heavies + jump assaults can't take) Orks- Blood Axes (Stealth item, heavies + jump assaults can't take) Eldar- Striking Scorpion (Same) Edit: I tried to format it neatly. The forums defy my attempts.
I don't think having any more stealth classes in this game would be a good idea. It's frustrating enough to die to Scorpions after two hits from wherever the hell they were hiding (oh boy, am I going to get flak for this). Actually, having different stuff for different factions is good. Makes them unique. Same with, say, Hawks vs. JPA. Also, re-adding the grav effect to eldar dragons (which was quite broken while it lasted) as a price for stealth would just not be worth it. Not that the knife ears would have any say in it - we'd just have to whine enough to get it for free (please don't).
