Alright on to LSM knife upgrades: Serrated: Overall more Damage for the knife. Combat Stims: Expensive Trinket (50LP) that improves Sprint and Evade Attack damage. Wolf Priests with their Mace's can Augment their healing grenades to set knives ablaze.
Xenos: Orks: Ramshackle Toughness: All Durability is decreased by one hit to, and against Ork weapons. To a minimum of 1/1. Knuckles are T1 Mace's and will break kill knife wielders in 3 clangs. They will die to weapons that clang against them in 2. Choppas are Axes. Clubs are maces. Chainchoppas are Chainswords. Eldar: No Maces. Therefore have entirely Precision Melee Weapons. This is just fine. All of their weapons could probably replace their clashing, damage, and pen options with other things instead.
I don't think anyone is arguing for that. I'd say there's quite a few things from CoD we should be staying away from.
Well regardless, call me a masochist I guess but as much as I hate Melee I still love it lol. Beat up rusted out old beast that it is it does me well despite all the bolt spam blacking out the sky. *most* of the time I can get it to work for me, the remainder of the time is frustrating as hell. I dono I just don't get any enjoyment from Ranged other than Swooping Hawk with Hunters Mark. Its the manual, calculated powerful shots while darting about the air and surprising the fuck outa your enemy by dropping down and cutting them to ribbons in Melee (because nobody expects a Melee Hawk). Just feels so much less cheese than just holding LMB down and /ADAD cancer
Just my 2 cents, but this is simply not true. I have a friend who is a couple of years older than me (making him early 40's) who has grown up using computers and can "use a mouse" but is terrible at PC gaming unless he uses a gamepad (yeah, I know, I've tried to teach him to no avail). So the difference between mouse play and gamepad play for ranged is immense without an auto-aim feature, which this game only has on smart pistols. At anything beyond 5-10 yards he would be shit unless he was particularly skilled at what he was doing. Hell, even with a gamepad he is still "below average" at best at ranged gameplay. But you know what? With a melee build and a gamepad, he can mash away, attempting to Rock Paper Scissors where required, but otherwise mash away and he is fine. I appreciate that the majority of PC gamers will be hardcore keyboard and mouse players with at least a modicum of skill and experience with ranged shooters, but "dumbing it down" to point and shoot is a sweeping generalization and you know it is. Personally I can see the skill required to play both playstyles well, mainly because I am not stubbornly sticking to a "if you do option A then you're clearly unskilled" or "if you can handle option B then you're a real veteran" mentality. Both have their pros and cons. Consistently claiming to the contrary does not convince anyone or make you right, in almost any form of argument, let alone a skill based one. Skill is based on "how well someone can do something" and not "how easy you personally believe something to be". That's like saying "I play the guitar, and that takes skill. Any idiot can bang on a drum!" when realistically, they are both completely different and require different skills and disciplines to get good at. Not only that but different people will have different affinities of what they naturally excel at and what they suck at. This seems to slip your grasp of context regularly. Just as a final word from me here, I want to reiterate that I enjoy playing both melee and ranged, with varying degrees of success at both, depending on the match. To keep trying to boil this down to a black and white or binary argument does nobody, including yourself, any favours in the slightest.
Stripped down to its absolute basics taking into account that both Ranged and Melee require to direct and position their attacks in the world, here's whats left: Ranged: 1 Action Hold LMB down (for continuous stream of fully adjustable 360 degree spherical high rate of fire at long, medium and short range) Melee: 3 Actions Tap RMB (for 1 partial trajectory adjustable attack at a time at 90 degrees directly in front in close quarters combat only) Hold RMB down (for 1 partial trajectory adjustable attack at a time at 90 degrees directly in front in close quarters combat only) Tap your assigned Dbash button (for 1 partial trajectory adjustable attack at a time at 90 degrees directly in front in close quarters combat only) 3 things is more than 1 thing last I checked. Therefore at that very basic level Melee is more complex than Ranged. Spoiler: BUNCH OF OTHER STUFF Solution that will never happen: Give Melee a "continuous stream of fully adjustable 360 degree spherical high rate attacks in close quarters combat" with viable options for bridging the gap and we're starting on the track to equality. Explanation of trajectory alteration for Melee vrs Ranged Ranged don't need or have trajectory alteration due to their high rate of fire giving greater allowance for accuracy they have the blissful illusion of full fluid trajectory alteration (their shots are rapid enough with instant delivery to target that it doesn't matter that the trajectory of fire cannot be altered (except for Reapers with their Starshot homing missiles) Melee's long drawn out glacial animations have partial trajectory alteration only up to a certain point along the arc. Delivery of attack for Melee is so slow you could never mistake it for instant which is why this is in place to allow for some semblance of accuracy, but by no means anywhere near as pin point accurate as Ranged. The fact that Ranged can shoot anywhere they like in a 360 degree sphere where Melee are stuck swinging directly in front of them gives Ranged a multitude of advantages over Melee, here's a few: Melee cant swing up or down or anywhere but directly in front of them. eg: Targets a few stairs below you? aim down all you want your only going to swing at air. Targets on a box and want to cut their knees off? NOP! your swinging at that box! Or to climb on the box / boosting up there with your fuel cell while their shooting you in the face. The only way to combat this is to move down the stairs so your on equal footing while they shoot you in the head (because Ranged are allowed a 360 degree sphere of rapid fire on any angle and Melee's not) The whole system is bent towards Rangeds favor. Melee is an absolute misery of inconsistent rules and janky netcode errors (a bit like reversing an Elephant stuffed in a fridge with arm holes for their weapons around the battlefield, swinging in vein as their blows slide off their targets like a greased pea) in a system designed for Ranged because that's where the money is people! Ranged meta ftw! $$$
3 whole things eh? Even Orkz can count that high man. How about this? Ranged option 1 - Fire from the hip Ranged option 2 - ADS firing Ranged option 3 - Activate / deactivate the scope before firing Just because you have 3 options in melee does not negate the fact that you potentially have 3 choices in ranged. Like I say, I'm happily on the fence here because I think both styles require skill, different types of skill agreed, but skill none the less. You have been posting pretty much the same thing since beta testing meaning that you are convinced you are right and everyone else must be wrong. The point of my post is that you are blinded by your own narrow mindedness and outright refuse to consider that you are either A) wrong or at the very least B) only partially correct. To use guitar and drumming as an example again (guitar being melee in case you hadn't figured it out already): A standard guitar has six strings and potentially between 19 and 27 frets. A drum kit can almost be as big as you want it to be, but essentially boils down to "someone banging the thing with another thing". Being able to "bang the thing" correctly must seem so easy to the guitar player, what with all the different notes they can play compared to "hitting the thing", but that doesn't negate the skill required to play the drums well. A guitarist can learn to play form reading sheet music, where as the drummer is going to be more rhythmic. Again, both equally valid skills in their own right. If you still cannot comprehend this basic comparison and see that "both require different skills" and that "just because you have more 'notes' to play" makes you a better musician, then I hope to dear Gork & Mork that you never join a band. My point here is not that any one is better than the other (which seems to be your one and only mantra in the 18 or so months I've been on the forums), it's that people can be equally skilled at different things. Again, just because you deem something to be simple does not make it so, despite how many times you spew it out ad nauseam. The real major skill in melee is gap closing allowing you to do what melee is supposed to do. The real major skill in ranged to to shoot someone before that can do the same to you, or to close the gap. I'll admit, the example in my last post is anecdotal and therefore worthless to the general masses, but if a total rube can pick up a gamepad and kill semi-reliably as melee but cannot do the same with ranged, it blows your argument out of the water. The skill curve is with the player as much as it is the play style, but sure, keep on flogging that dead horse. Before you consider saying "well, a real gamer would be using a mouse anyway", that's the point. There are multiple ways to play the game (both physically with peripherals, or play style) which the community at large have accepted and adapted to. You know, the ones who can see that both play styles require skill in their own right. In the meantime I guess we'll will all just have to sit and listen to you continue to play the same old song on your guitar on repeat claiming that any other type of music is for noobs. Your continued generalizations, unsurprisingly, are still doing you no favours. At the time of writing this is self-evident by the likes my previous post received for being fair and balanced, whilst your response sits patiently waiting for someone else equally narrow-minded to come along and agree with you. [EDIT] - Oh, and PS.... Anyone doing this... ...is an idiot. To even think that this is how the game is played shows sheer ignorance or indifference to acknowledge there is more complexity to this whether you like it or not. To counter your point I offer you "recoil" and "needing to hit the target". If the ranged player held down LMB and turned round 360 degrees he wouldn't be killing shit except maybe his team mates. To be competitive they will need to fire in short controlled bursts, and constantly be manually correcting their aim.
Haven't logged on for days, Glad to see my post is still running strong on sheer rage and vitriol. Just as planned.
