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In Development: Scream While Dying (TM) - Updated

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Oveur, Nov 30, 2017.


But Angron can be nice?

  1. No.

  2. Seriously. No.

  3. No. You are totally getting banned for not following the rules.

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  1. Delgear Steam Early Access

    Theres a whole lot you aren't taking into account in your pointless argument.
    ALL of these games Every single one of them has much more mobility in relation to the weapons dps. They all have WAY more artificial TTK than EC does. Tribes was THE defining TPS for almost 8 years. and it had over double our TTK, outside very difficult and gimmick instant kills like sticking a landmine on an enemy and shooting it with the disc launcher, or getting direct hit with a mortar that bounces a couple of times before detonation. most of those games have jumping mechanics (bunny hopping is dumb as is ADAD strafing if you want to talk about a non tactical mechanic there ya go right there).

    Most of these games also have one shot kills in melee ... is that exactly how you want quick attacks from JPA's to work ? because in battlefield that is how they work and you cant even clang them in battlefield you just get deleted.

    low ttk = more tactical or strategic
    high ttk = strategic or more tactical.
    ^^ Both of the above statements are FASLE, the TTK alone has NOTHING to do with whether a game is tactical, and i would argue at their extremes BOTH remove tactical elements from the game.
    Lowering TTK from where we are would continue to remove tactical choice from the game DUE TO OUR ALREADY CREATED GAME MECHANICS.

    we have slow response and turn speed.
    we have HUGE silhouettes it is approximately 66% easier for you to land shots AND headshots in this game than most of the games you listed.
    We have ABYSMALLY low recoil it takes almost 25 kills in a row to push a default rifle off silhouette.
    Due to that recoil/huge silhouette shrinking your silhouette has no effect on your ttl.
    We have INCREDIBLY slower melee animations that aren't going to be significantly changing any time soon without a mocap team.
    We have already programmed assets that arent really being utilized fully like stamina/stamina regen/armor regen.
    I would argue that sadly i think that Overwatch is in many ways MORE strategic than battlefield ..... the vast majority of weapons in battlefield will gib you .... there really isnt a lot of reason to pick one over another save maybe range which is why inevitably in over 90% of those types of games at the competitive level it breaks down into assault weapon flush play or sniper play. Many of the choices in these games are not as tactical as they "seem".
    How much does stamina regen in a straight up bolter duel increase your TTL ?
    How much does armor regen ?
    How long does it take you to bounce right back into the action after a bad decision you managed to survive.

    you can absolutely implement MANY more tactical elements into this game if you give people a scoche more TTL .. the healing doesn't have to be so strong and abundant, running out of ammo and being stuck on your melee weapons can be a thing, there is so much strategic diversity and different situations we can put our players in if we back off the TTK.
    I'm not impressed that much by people who run up 30 kill sin this game ..... compared to the skill it used to take to do that in games like tribes, this games kill count is almost entirely reliant on starting the dps race ahead ... because after you win you bounce right back if you drop it to .5 seconds that wont change the winner just pops behind cover taps an apoth or a box, or uses a medkit and theres NO FREAKING CONSEQUENCES to the 8 bullets they took. Wheres the frigen tactical element there ? with a higher TTK you could make it so boxes just give you your consumables back .... and NO HEALING and no AMMO unless you had the ammo pack or medkit as deployable consumables in your loadout, you could drop the heal rate of all support classes and the medkit. so more often wounds have consequences.

    I get that raising ttk reduces the effectiveness of flanking, but flanking isnt the ONLY tactical element of a tactical shooter and all of the other elements are presently suffering to buff up flanking.
    As long as you implement changes that address the fact that flanking will be harder and less effective (look at the video and discussion i posted about "artillery" style weapons like the PC and rokkit) you can easily make up for it.
    being wounded and out of ammo and knowing "you have to take/hold that point against all odds" is as WH40k as it gets and the chance you will be in that situation in our current meta is pretty much -0

    I remember back when the orks first came out and the ToC was playing a match i ran out of ammo on my tac and just kept on fighting because of the whaagh there was no time for us to hit the boxes .... i remember commenting to one of my teamates ... i wish they would let me at least throw my bolt pistol at them ....There should be a chance in this game you wind up being in that situation ..... it should feel that grimdark that you feel the need to throw an empty firearm at them as a last resort.
  2. Krayt Krayt Preacher

    15 pen vs suppression i wonder wich one is better :OrkMoon:
  3. Arteek Arteek First Blood!

    Didn't know PUBG, cs:go or fortnite had more mobility than marines with jetpacks and flying eldars

    oh okay you're one of those ADAD guys who whine people don't stand still, nevermind then.
  4. Delgear Steam Early Access

    theres nothing wrong with ADAD strafing making shots miss ... theres something wrong with bobbing back and forth not affecting your aim........THATS the part thats BS there should be a shoulder roll when you change directions im guessing you didnt watch any of the videos and have no idea what im proposing because you dont sound like you have any idea what i said. In fact if you look at the changes i proposed ADAD strafing would actually be BETTER at mitigating damage in my system it would however have a hard tax on your accuracy ... so it would be good if you are outnumbered and trying to stall for time but not so good if you need to down someone .... almost like adad would then become a STRATEGIC CHOICE with a CONSEQUENCE. im sorry did you hear a point driven home ? no ? maybe it was just me.

    They have smaller silhouettes than the JPA, and the JPA and the hawk are not "standard classes" every other class in the game suffers from the situations i proposed .... im sure you know that you are just being unnecessarily contrary. The JPA is limited to primarily melee damage it makes perfect mechanical sense for him to have a gap closer he has no other viable way to engage a main hand rifle class. and the Eldar SH is pretty much a special case as they are the ONLY race with a unit exactly like that in game. The SH is special because he has to fit into the eldars special racial strategy of "sticking and moving" that same SH is also much squishier than other classes in the game ... as is the JPA.

    Both the JPA and the SH can be "Knocked out of the air" and essentially animation locked for almost 4X thier ttk if you clip them in the air and they dont have another charge to reasert flight.

    You are trying to take a situational and pretend its the norm across the game when it isn't. try again.
    Orkan likes this.
  5. Krayt Krayt Preacher

    LOBOTRONUS likes this.
  6. Mkoll Oan-Mkoll Steam Early Access

    recoil of the AC is actually almost 3 times but with 1/4th of firerate its actually easier to control and more sniper like. so getting headshots is easier.(ignoring spread since it does not matter when braced)

    the AC isstronger since it does more damage (6.7ish% on dps but alpha is higher cause of bullet damage) and it does this damage easier. regarding suppression you should ofc has some heavy bolters in a team to get the enemy suppressed but not everyone should use HB to maximize damage output
    Aislinn and Delgear like this.
  7. Delgear Steam Early Access

    Ideally in a well balanced game thats a question you actually have to ask yourself ..... in EC ... not so much.
  8. Delgear Steam Early Access

    The reason the AC seems so strong is due to the coding for first shot ... it has a very high alpha damage of approximately 240 to the body before the enemy player can even react since the first shot is instant and then the shots/sec speed factors in.

    I addressed this in my example by making the recoil push it off silhouette after that so a re-aim is required. that way it can keep its high alpha damage (its defining characteristic) and still be more fair.

    ALso in response to krayt i reduced the effectiveness of suppression .... without feeling the scale i cant be sure it was enough but the idea was with the static normal recoil being higher that suppression would have to come down somewhat devaluing it.
    In my build the ac actually has higher dps too.
  9. Delgear Steam Early Access

    That was pretty close range though i doubt any reasonable stats as far as recoil, accuracy or spread would have had much impact on the outcome of that fight ... it was all point blank. Its a terrible example.
  10. Arteek Arteek First Blood!

    Blaming ADAD for the lack of tracking skill in a game that clearly runs around 30 fps on his pc, if not lower...

    Moving affects the accuracy of pretty much every gun quite badly except for the bolter which is half decent without aiming but it only really becomes good when combined with a slanesh mark on a csm. And that wouldn't even be a problem if people would run the game at a decent framerate.

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