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How to Counter Eldar Army?

Discussion in 'Table Top' started by acepost, Jun 28, 2017.

  1. acepost acepost Active Member

    Hi guys I was wondering how to counter this Eldar army? This is a list I made with my friends, just wondering how to counter and play this list. Any opinion is welcome, thanks! 1500 points limit game. Using the Brigade Detachment.

    HQ:

    1 Eldrad Ulthran

    1 Warlock - 1 Witchblade

    1 Warlock - 1 Witchblade

    Sub Total HQ: 254 pts


    Troops:

    8 Storm Guardians - 3 Chainsword

    8 Storm Guardians - 2 Chainsword

    8 Storm Guardians - 2 Chainsword

    8 Storm Guardians - 2 Chainsword

    8 Storm Guardians - 2 Chainsword

    8 Storm Guardians - 2 Chainsword

    Sub Total Troops: 349 pts

    Elites:

    5 Fire Dragons

    5 Striking Scorpions

    1 Howling Banshee Exarch

    Sub Total Elites: 231 pts

    Fast Attack:

    3 Shining Spears - 2 Laser Lance, 1 Star Lance

    3 Shining Spears - 2 Laser Lance, 1 Star Lance

    1 Vyper - 1 Shuriken Cannon, 1 Twin Shuriken Catapult

    Sub Total Fast Attack: 290 pts

    Heavy Support:

    3 Dark Reapers - 2 Reaper Launchers, 1 Aeldari Missile Launcher

    1 Fire Prism - 1 Twin Shuriken Catapault, 1 Crystal Targeting Matrix

    1 War Walker - 2 Bright Lance

    Sub Total Heavy Support: 376 pts
  2. Demetri Dominov Demetri_Dominov Arkhona Vanguard

    What army are you using?
  3. acepost acepost Active Member

    I was thinking maybe Loyalist Space Marines, Vanilla.
  4. Sariel Searva Ordinate

    Curious how your buddy is taking a single howling banshee exarch when howling banshee minimum unit size is 5.

    Also against Footdar? Shoot them off the table. His only units with high effective ranges are the Bright Lances on the War Walker, The Fire Prism, the Dark Reapers, the shining spears, and I guess sorta the striking scorpions.


    1500 pts in the current edition is like a 1k-1.2k pt game in 8th so he definitely has a lot of bodies but many of them are pretty slow. Fire Dragons for example only have a 19" effective range at a -1 to hit.

    Your buddies army does lots of things okay but doesn't really excel at any one thing. Take a couple pieces of anti vehicle and lots of shots while focusing down the few things you are afraid of and you should be fine.
    My scaled down list with DA Battalion

    Iron Wing Protocols/Dark Angels Parking Lot:
    HQ 330
    Azrael
    Techmarine
    Techmarine

    Troops 220
    5 scouts
    5 scouts
    5 scouts
    5 scouts

    Fast Attack 138
    Dark Shroud

    Heavy Support 404
    Las Pred with Las Sponsons
    Las Pred with Las Sponsons

    Dedicated Transports 400
    Razorback Assault Cannons
    Razorback Assault Cannons
    Razorback Assault Cannons
    Razorback Assault Cannons

    106 Wounds


    Thats 8 Lascannon shots at to pop vehicles rerolling hits if they are within 6 of Azrael. 48 Assault Cannon shots at bodies rerolling hits if within 6 of Azrael. Dark Shroud has 3 Heavy Bolter Shots and you are -1 to hit against units within 6." 2 Techmarines repair vehicles while having a 2+ armour. Azrael gives all units within 6" a 4+ Invuln. Scouts can deploy 9" away from enemy deployment zone so they can either tie things up or sit on objectives.

    Current Rules as Written I have 14 drops while your buddy has 17 so I can choose to go first.

    Las Pred vs. Fire Prism. 4 Lascannon shots without moving hit on 3s so with rerolls 3-4 hit. Wound on 3s wound 2-3 times. Takes the Prism to a 6+ Save so 2-3 get through. That's 2-18 wounds. Call average a 9. After 1 Pred the Fire Prism is now only moving 8" hitting on 6's against something within 6" of my Dark Shroud. He's effectively nuetralized.

    Las Pred vs War Walker. Shooting is same as above. War Walker has a 5+ invln so 1-2 get through instead so thats 1-12 wounds call average a 6 so that's a dead War Walker.

    Twin Assault Cannon Razor vs Shinning Spears. 12 shots with rerolls so 10-11 hit. 7-8 Wounds. 4+ Save means 3-4 wounds so 1-2 dead.

    We'll do that twice, since there's 2 units of Spears. with 48 shots that should be 4 dead Spears.

    Your buddy is now down to 3 characters, 6 objective holders, Striking Scorpions (9" charge the turn they come in), Foot slogging Dragons, a Vyper, a pretty nullified Prism, and Dark Reapers which are definitely the biggest threat remaining.

    If it were me Eldrad would cast fortune on either the Dark Reapers or the Vyper and Guide on either the Dark Reapers or the Vyper and he would most likely be out of range for Doom. 7 is average on 2 dice so 1 should go off. 1 Warlock can cast Conceal on either the Vyper or the Reapers.

    Reapers vs Any Vehicle. 3 shots hitting on 3s rerolling means 2-3 hit. Wounding on 3s 1-2 Wounds. 4+ Invulns so 0-1 go through so thats either 0 or 3 damage on any vehicle within 6" of Azrael.

    After turn 1 except for the Vyper and the degrade Prism, everything gets wounded on 2+ by Assault Cannons and 1 more round of las shooting should be able to take out the last 2 vehicles.


    Vehicles have a huge presence this edition with a toughness value and lots of wounds.
  5. acepost acepost Active Member

    [Current Rules as Written I have 14 drops while your buddy has 17 so I can choose to go first]

    What exactly this mean, which page of which rulebook are you refering to? Please clarify thanks.

    Regarding the 1 howling banshee Exarch it is agreed by my friends and me to be using the rule on page 242 of the core rulebook for understrength units, just not enough models. No problem with me...

    [Azrael gives all units within 6" a 4+ Invuln.]

    I read the rulebook again, it says MODELS not units within 6" gain the 4+ Invuln save...

    [Fire Dragons for example only have a 19" effective range at a -1 to hit.]

    Correct me if I am wrong but Fire Dragons have battle focus, so negate the -1 to hit for using their fusion guns and can advance and shoot?

    Thanks for the advice I will think about it.
  6. Sariel Searva Ordinate


    If you look at deployment now in any of the mission types, you alternate deploying units. The player who finishes setting up their army first can choose to go 1st or second just like Age of Sigmar. They did this to balance out strategy of placing your army and balance out MSU spam lists like your buddy is using. Its quite a bit more balanced and you have to think more tactically where you are going to place your models. ITC has changed the first turn part to be a +1 to see who goes first rather than just getting to choose.

    Yup Azrael is models, doesnt really matter when you are surrounding him with 6 tanks a speeder and 2 Techmarines. 6" is plenty to have everything to tapping. The full list is even more tankls and it still works out fine.

    You are absolutely right about the fire dragons. Fusion guns are assault anyway so they are fine. That bumps them up to on average a 23" effective range. They might be a decent target priority now. They still are doubled out by assault cannons so 12 shots hitting on 3s rerolling is 10-11 hits, wounding on 2s is 8-9 wounds. 3+ save goes to a 4+ so that's 4-5 dead.

    So maybe I leave 1 set of Spears alone and murder the dragons instead. I can probably box out the spears with scouts anyways.

    Really if you can find anything to spam thats S6 AP -1, Eldar are going to have a problem. Storm Raven spam is also gonna be popular.
  7. acepost acepost Active Member

    Friends made a new list for 1500 points limit for the Eldar, here it is:

    HQ:

    1 Eldrad Ulthran

    1 Warlock - 1 Witchblade

    1 Warlock - 1 Witchblade

    Sub Total HQ: 254 pts


    Troops:

    8 Storm Guardians - 1 Chainsword

    8 Storm Guardians

    8 Storm Guardians

    8 Storm Guardians

    8 Storm Guardians

    8 Storm Guardians

    Sub Total Troops: 337 pts

    Elites:

    5 Fire Dragons - 120 pts

    5 Striking Scorpions - 95 pts

    1 Howling Banshees Exarch - 16 pts

    Sub Total Elites: 231 pts

    Fast Attack:

    1 Vyper - 1 Bright Lance, Twin Shuriken Catapult

    1 Vyper - 1 Aeldari Missile Launcher, Twin Shuriken Catapult

    1 Vyper - 1 Shuriken Cannon, Twin Shuriken Catapult

    Sub Total Fast Attack: 279 pts

    Heavy Support:

    3 Dark Reapers - 2 Reaper Launchers, 1 Aeldari Missile Launcher

    3 Dark Reapers - 2 Reaper Launchers, 1 Aeldari Missile Launcher

    3 Dark Reapers - 2 Reaper Launchers, 1 Aeldari Missile Launcher

    1 War Walker - 1 Bright Lance, 1 Shuriken Cannon

    Sub Total Heavy Support: 399 pts

    I am still in the process of borrowing models from friends for Loyalist Space Marines, how do you counter this list in Meta and how would you play it? Thanks for any advice.

    Here is the rough battle plan for this army:

    The Dark Reapers hide in cover and nuke vehicles. 2+ save, 3+ to hit and wound Marine vehicles.

    War Walkers take their chances with the Bright lance & Shuriken Cannon whilst trying to flank enemy vehicles.

    The Missile launcher Vyper combo nuke with Dark Reapers.

    The Bright lance Vyper can try to get into position to use the bright lance, not too sure must see enemy formation.

    On turn 2, Striking Scorpions, Vypers, and Storm Guardians can try to charge into assault. Eldrad would be using Smite and Fortune & Guide, or Guide & Doom.

    Basically this a beginner list, If you can try and go through the meta with me on how to better use this Eldar army please help. My friend tried the Dark Angel list recommended and played the Meat Grinder mission, I managed to win with all his units destroyed, I managed to get the first turn as Eldar. I think maybe a different army for Space Marines might be better, still thinking about but thanks for the help.
  8. acepost acepost Active Member

    [If you look at deployment now in any of the mission types, you alternate deploying units. The player who finishes setting up their army first can choose to go 1st or second just like Age of Sigmar. They did this to balance out strategy of placing your army and balance out MSU spam lists like your buddy is using. Its quite a bit more balanced and you have to think more tactically where you are going to place your models. ITC has changed the first turn part to be a +1 to see who goes first rather than just getting to choose.]

    I am looking to play Crucible of War missions. The rules for first turn are different than Eternal War Missions and Maelstrom of War Missions. I am also looking at Open Play Missions where the first turn is decided by roll off. So it is technically not true that Space Marines would always get the first turn depending on missions chosen.
  9. So, what is with your friend and the 1 Banshee Exarch? I know that technically you can run an understrength squad but it's a bit weird. Especially with the new split fire rules since it's not a HQ and you don't have to dedicate a whole squad to mow it down. It's like a free kill point, unless you're choosing to let it be it doesn't even get the benefit of not being able to be targeted when behind another squad.

    If it were me I'd blast her with a Krak missile right away and get first blood.

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