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Heavy Bolter and Autocannon: no whine, just facts fot you to decide.

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by BoBBer, Dec 8, 2016.

  1. I dont get Grav... I get shitty gun... and full forum of players who tries to tald me that my weapon IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE PLAYED AT ALL because it's supposed to be less powerfull.

    Who would play less powerful weapon?
    There is no balance if you may ALWAYS play with OP weapons... and never with Heavy Bolter.
  2. Mongobeef Mongobeef Subordinate

    Had some decent queue times the other day as orks surprisingly...I haven't touched eldar since the fusion incident
    Ya know for a knife ear I'd actually probably not try to gut you on sight on the field of battle.

    Probably cause I'm terrible with a knife and I need ashes for my paints.
    Valnak likes this.
  3. Azzagtot Azzagtot Drill Abbott

    Are eldar still in game?
  4. Mongobeef Mongobeef Subordinate

    You get grav guns. You not using the best tactical weapon for the situation is your fault

    Nobody here is saying HB shouldn't be used. We are asking you to use your damn brain and identify situations where it is a good idea and one's where it isn't

    HB isn't weak. It is different and that's not bad. Suppression is underrated and the fire potential in even a couple people in the same firing arc with HBs is terrifying
    Wiawyr likes this.
  5. Xio Valency Xi0 Preacher

    Well one of my favourite classes is the weakest melee class in the game right now, my capper is 80% of a space marine these days, my heavy has an even weaker guns and has even cost more on some (believe it or not weaker than your favorite gun), my race has fragile tanks, over half of my faction only has 1 weapon and my faction no longer receives buffs.

    I want my Scorpion to be usable and good but he is still missing 70% of his gear and is weaker in almost every aspect to marine melee, you need to learn that not everything you love will be good, I love las blasters but I don't expect it to win against a bolt pistol neither do I expect a Guardman to kill Magnus the Red with his bayonet.
    Anthemyos, Celestia and Mongobeef like this.
  6. Mongobeef Mongobeef Subordinate

    Did you notice they still haven't fixed scorps not even having the wargear available for the faster stealth stone? I've had it unlocked for ages but it isn't equippable
    Xi0 likes this.
  7. Celestia Celestia Prefectus

    Yes, I executed a yellow warlock yesterday.
    Mongobeef and Galen like this.
  8. Xarl Uthullun Amdusias New Member

    Dude, I get the Assassin commendation pretty regularly with HB when I play LSM (and when I can actually join at the beginning of a match). And I play the objective too, I don't just brace in a single spot and wait for people to come to me.
  9. Forgrim Forj Battle-Skald

    @BoBBer

    First up, I'm someone who specialises in the HB to such a degree that I've played exactly one full match each with the PC and AC, and I've only just reached three play sessions total with a Swooping Hawk. I love me some HB, and like you, it's the reason I play.

    I disagree with almost everything you've said.

    The only real problem with the AC is that latency boosts its alpha-strike capability. The increase of 1 extra bullet-to-kill, whilst keeping the same DPS, should be a good interim measure while they work on latency issues. Otherwise, it's only as more powerful than the HB as it should be. I've tried it, got more kills, went back to HB because I prefer it.

    I love ruining an AC users day. I get suppression on them and they can't hit shit. Suppression is what the HB is about - this class of weapon is the only thing in the game that can reduce incoming damage on you and your team by completely negating some shots. If that unique ability isn't enough for you, I don't know what to tell you.

    It sounds to me like you haven't found your groove, and are struggling to make the HB an effective weapon. I feel you man, it's got a fairly steep learning curve, and takes some experience to really get the most out of it. I've found that stacking survivability stats helps. If you want some help figuring things out, send me a PM, or take a look at my stuff on Steam or here. You can also drop in over at http://forum.eternalcrusade.com/threads/forgrims-heavy-bolter-feedback.49497/page-182, but be warned that you won't find a lot of support for outright buffs there - we tend to take a more measured approach and instead talk about tweaks that would help the HB work as it should in regards to EC. The current discussion is actually about what suppression should look like.

    Good luck out there.
    JojoKasei, Xeltan, Drakonite and 4 others like this.
  10. You deny the facts or what? (I mean I tried to make calculations, not assumptions)
    I've made a test... test showed that HB does have 100% more recoil, 50% more spread area, 44% less damage... in same conditions. It's like 4 times less effective in total.
    I tried to show how "stats magic" makes "good paper balance" not working in reality at all.
    What's wrong with the test?
    Or it's like my personal opinion? So you may just deny it?
    It's unique... but it's not effective enough... to make up for 4 times less firepower (when not point blank and not braced).
    That's because I feel like I'm being fooled.
    Real Heavy Bolter:
    *
    The Heavy Bolter (also known as Back Breaker[15]) is an enormous version of the Boltgun. Of much larger size and weight, the heavy bolter fires powerful armor-piercing fist-sized bolts at the enemy with a staggering rate of fire.[7][6]*
    *The Heavy Bolter has an anti-infantry fire support role in an Imperial Guard unit, and is a very powerful weapon due to the rocket-propelled explosive rounds it fires.*
    *The Heavy Bolter fires a .998 calibre bolt, larger than the .75 calibre bolt used by the standard pattern Bolter, and makes use of the same gyro-stabilising technology as the standard Bolter's shells.*

    So YES HB should be an effective weapon. It already IS! But not in this game... Why? Here it's a debuffing low damage support with extra recoil, extra spread, low overheat capacity. And with bullets less powerful than standard Bolter's.

    Thank you, sir!

    Ok... I've found the answer!
    http://www.librarium-online.com/for...-sm-heavy-weapons-heavy-bolters-any-good.html
    Looks like everything is OK... HB is supposed to be useless.
    HB was good when I was a child)
    Everything matches.

    All the manuals were made years ago... when HB's were powerful weapon. Looks like now it's not.
    Now I understand why the words are so much better than the reality.

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