Yes, a loyal and dedicated fanbase is what helps a game thrive and get a good start -- keyword being start. If everybody that wants to try this game at/after launch as an ork boy sees nothing but people who were willing to give up $450 out of blind faith completely dominating the PVP with exclusive advantages that they can never get, that's gonna immediately kill all possible future sales, and then what? How are they going to keep making enough money to keep the game servers up and running, besides introducing full-on, balls to the wall P2W microtransactions? What the ork boyz think after their first couple of hours playing and interacting with the community is what's ultimately going to make or break this game. I'm not saying it should dumbed down for "casuals" or "scrubs", just that everybody should play by the same rules, and that's why all this talk of sidegrades worries me. Look at games like TF2; even with millions of dollars and hundreds upon hundreds of patches, there are still "sidegrade" weapons that are considered objectively better by the community, and the only reason Valve gets away with this is that, despite having a pay store, you can earn everything that isn't just re-skins through gameplay. Hiding them behind a paywall -- with some options locked away forever to only a few choice people -- can only be impossible to balance at best, and damage control for P2W at worst.
I guess one can argue in circles for ever if one doesnt take into account the fact that EVERYTHING you can buy in store ie side grade or the 2 seaters are going to be earnable/findable or what ever. The big wet diaper thing I keep hearing is the 2 seaters.... they will be founder only skins on them, but after a 6 months to a year later they will be available to EVERY ONE, just the skin on it is founder only.
I know it might just be an example, but I think a lot of people are going a little bit over board with the Attack Bike. Its just an Attack Bike. Take the tabletop for an example... Only one (yeah, I know multiple space marine books yadda yadda) army can roll an Attack Bike. Do you hear anyone on the interwebs or game stores lamenting that because Tau can't have Attack Bikes that Space Marines are OP? I really don't think Attack Bikes being available only to Founders is going unbalance anything. Take into consideration that this is planned to be a large scale game. Two dudes on a bike are not going to be the lynchpin. Even 20 dudes on ten bikes is not really going to change much. I think a lot of people are throwing around this old mentality of WoW arenas or something. I really don't think there will be some kind of weapon that overshadows the rest because the combats are going to be so big. Honestly, I'm more worried about the weapons/vehicles that are getting full release. Ten Predators sounds a lot worse to me than 20 Attack Bikes. I really think we all just need to sit back and watch. I have no reason not to trust the ladies and gents at Behavior and I really don't think anyone else has any reasons either. Maybe once we get 6 months out of a finished product and things seem unbalanced then you can grab the torches and pitchforks. Right now, my focus is making sure what they make looks like 40k and feels like 40k.
It's not just an attack bike, it's an attack bike and 2 heroes for each faction and that's just the first wave of items on the store, I'm more worried about taking little bits of game at a time and start selling them year and a half before release, if I dislike games with day 1 DLC imagine what I think of day -700 DLC...
If bikes (bikes seems like a confirm) and land speeders arnt introduced, attack bikes will be p2w. Even if they are its still you buy power/ flexibility/ ability and not time. Dont forget the heavy bolter, faster relocation, if guilds/ groups/ strikforces can abuse this its P2W. It feels like a pure money grabber if its just exclusive for limited time then everyone has it, but thats some kind of balance atleast. Solution (different ways): 1. Make RTP acquirable in game. 2. Make attack bike (and alike) an achievment in game requirering 10-100 hours. 3. Make 5% (or so) population restriction on owning that sidegrade. 4. Make it time esclusive, 1-3 weeks(?) then everyone gets it? Sure keep/ change the skin color. 5. Avarage - long cool down till when you can use it again (like heroes). Havnt seen that suggestion before. There would probably have to be a pre-order month(s?) before its added for the company to be able to drag in some cash on it. If the p2p item is is p2p exclusive for 3-9 months i can see it becomming p2w, after everyone got that item devs brings some new item, or they have it like every 3rd month. That would be semi-p2w, semi money grabber. The only way it would stay true to "money is time and time is money, you dont buy power" is if its pre-order for 1-2 months and the duration till everyone else gets is is equal to an achievement 10-100 hours=1-4 weeks? You bring up a valid point indeed. -------------------------------------------- Similar topic: ((poll) founders get p2w stuff?) - http://forum.eternalcrusade.com/threads/unique-gameplay-elements.18379/ ((poll) prefered business model?) - http://forum.eternalcrusade.com/threads/what-is-pay-2-win-for-you-in-todays-game-world.3182/ ((poll) how implement sidegrade system?) - http://forum.eternalcrusade.com/threads/poll-sidegrades-paywall.30091/ (microtransactions) - https://forum.eternalcrusade.com/th...e-know-its-coming-devs-need-to-see-this.3002/ 1st post vid youtube.com/watch?v=O-ILszuIEIM - youtube.com/watch?v=JNWF3h45At0&feature=youtu.be (make rtp acquirable in game) - https://forum.eternalcrusade.com/threads/micro-transactions-and-rtp.25147/#post-466050 (sidegrades, RTP store prices) http://forum.eternalcrusade.com/thr...s-store-rogue-trader.22908/page-3#post-486110 (high priced packages good/bad for EC?) https://forum.eternalcrusade.com/th...under-vs-eternal-crusade-founder.22388/page-4 (p2p content for everyone!) - https://forum.eternalcrusade.com/th...esent-your-potential-playerbase.19853/page-22 (early access, monetization)- https://forum.eternalcrusade.com/th...dayz-and-crowdfunding.4497/page-3#post-195962 (business model) - https://forum.eternalcrusade.com/threads/forbes-vs-mmorpg-com-the-p2p-is-dead.4169/ (EC store, whats ok/not?) - https://forum.eternalcrusade.com/threads/the-cash-shop.1546/ (sidegrades are pay-wall/p2w!) - http://forum.eternalcrusade.com/threads/sidegrade-and-balance-are-two-different-things.30249/page-3 (unique p2p features are p2w) http://forum.eternalcrusade.com/threads/lets-face-it-unique-gameplay-elements-are-pay-2-win.20648/
og og og his (X) looks different?!? P2W?!?!? ok so we can have a store that sells things and have a game, or not have a store and then can have no game. hmmmmm, no brainer? This store is selling some things apart from a skin are attainable in game so wtf is your gripe? its not like you can go and buy The Sword of a Thousand Cuts!!1111!!!11!!!2 and then you get to Pwnz0rz dem nubs cuz I got it on the store. what exactly is this thing thats being purchased that makes a win? Internet keyboard commandos taking issue with ANYTHING. ok so lets say Tau or Dark Eldar come out and you have to pay for it.... is that going to be pay2win? or are you expecting the developers to work for nothing? oh and btw this isnt communist (insert country here) shit aint free and in order to create and keep lights on it costs money, game wont have a sub. and you NEVER need to buy anything in the store and you have the same experience as the dood with a black amex and no life, he is just going to look better doing it. So how about less chicken little and more wait and actually TRY the game. oh ya is it going to be P2W because some one gets 3 months practice because they actually supported this game before some one who "waits and sees"? jeebus seriously.
So, in your opinion, if Attack Bikes are Founders only and there are no Land Speeders, Attack Bikes are overpowered and play to win? That's your line of logic? With no statistics on any of these vehicles let alone really anything in the game. You're just ready to cry foul immediately? I'm normally a bit wary of DLC, but this is a bit different from what I can tell. I can see where you wouldn't want to throw down a lot of money on something that isn't even a reality yet though.
you have understand nothing. you belive that if the exclusive ends every body will have the item unlocked???? no the item after the exclusive will be in the shop! you continue to say that the game shop will have only skin.. this is totally false! dev never say something similar! stop spread false info!!!!! (and in the last interwiev miguel never talked about time exclusive he talk only about founder exclusive)
