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Forgrims Heavy Bolter Feedback

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Forj, Nov 21, 2015.

  1. Zaeryn Zaeryn Master

    The Heavy Bolter causes screen blur and flinch, making it more difficult for players to see and more difficult to accurately hit targets with their reticle bouncing around, so I have no idea why it also causes reticle spread.
  2. Forgrim Forj Battle-Skald

    You can jump backwards directly out of braced. This is how I get out of incoming fire, I jump backwards and then crouch. The extra movement gives enough time to make it into crouch. Most times.

    It would be nice if I could also brace from crouch, and vault over the cover from braced.
    Zaeryn likes this.
  3. Forgrim Forj Battle-Skald

    Thanks to everyone who has been leaving comments here. I really want to specialise in Heavy Bolter, so it's important to me that we help Behaviour make that an enjoyable experience. As a side note, I've been playing as Loyalist exclusively, to try and keep the rest of my experience as consistent as possible. On to the next rounds of my feedback.

    CQB Testing

    Ok, so I’ve been testing out bringing my Heavy Bolter up close and personal, and I’ve found it largely unrewarding in comparison to providing covering fire from a distance. I’ve seen people mention how effective it is, even unbraced hip-firing, but that has not been my experience. I also didn’t feel very different to any other run and gun shooter, except I’m slower than everyone else. It’s a high-risk playstyle for me, with no greater reward.

    Bringing suppression to the party inside a building is good, and I'll keep doing this when safe. However, I didn’t feel like this made a difference compared to to me bringing some other weapon to the party.

    Even more so than supporting fire, this playstyle needs team support. I simply can’t respond quickly to running into someone - I can wound and suppress them, but I mostly died if I was alone. Because I’m slow and can’t roll, if I suddenly run into someone, or they come around the corner, I’m best off just standing and hip firing. I can’t get to cover fast enough to live, and bracing/aiming means I just start out behind on the time to kill stakes. Up close, Suppression doesn’t seem to be enough to stop them shooting me enough to put my aim off enough so that I stop landing shots. And once I stop landing shots, they’re not suppressed, and kill me. It’s still very much a case of, if I’m getting shot, I don’t take evasive action more than a short hop. There’s no reason for me to do otherwise.

    On a more general note, I’ve not been finding that suppression is a sufficient deterrent to my opponent shooting back, and a couple of lucky shots is enough to have me ducking for cover, or behind it if I’m shooting over/around it. Ironically, this is me being naturally suppressed even as I’m artificially suppressing them. I make it to cover about half the time.

    I wasn’t able to flank in an effective manner - too vulnerable and only truly effective once braced, which means if he’s got buddies I’m toast. I’m better off going in the same direction as the team in close quarters rather than trying to attack from the side. I’m also really easy to flank, given it’s in my best interests to keep my gun pointed near to where I might need to spool up and start firing. Bracing for accurate fire makes this vulnerability worse. It made me really cautious.

    Being up close also has it’s downsides in that it’s much easier to get interrupted by melee swings, casual or deliberate. Being inside makes it almost impossible to maintain distance. One oddity was once I was already shooting at close quarters, I didn’t think he was in melee distance, I’m pretty sure he was shooting, but something interrupted my shooting. I’m going to chalk it up to lag, and it was actually melee.

    I did not find the extra armour and health of a Devastator enough to lead a push forward or into a room. I had to play very cautiously compared to Tacticals, especially Stormbolters, who could rush into a room, dodge around, spray bullets, and often win.

    In summary, I found that CQB was a very fraught experience that occasionally shone when just the right situation presented itself. The danger of getting up close wasn’t worth the loss of long range supportive fire, even with the additional suppression I brought inside. However, it does make it worthwhile bringing the Heavy Bolter closer once a push begins and you run short of targets because the fight has moved into CQB.
    Zaeryn likes this.
  4. Zaeryn Zaeryn Master

    To be honest, your results should be the rule for the Heavy Bolter. It's limited mobility is supposed to make it a great medium and long range turret-like weapon with good medium range power on the move while being mostly ineffective in close combat. It's ineffectiveness compared to the Pistol that should be effective in CQC should be what causes you to change to the Pistol in close-quarters situations.
    Forj likes this.
  5. Forgrim Forj Battle-Skald

    I agree with you here. It felt like I was Doing It Wrong. The best outcome was learning how to use it in closer engagements when I had to.
    Zaeryn likes this.
  6. Forgrim Forj Battle-Skald

    Actually, just tested and I can brace from a crouch, which is nice. I was sure I'd tried that before...
    Zaeryn likes this.
  7. Demetri Dominov Demetri_Dominov Arkhona Vanguard

    If you want to use the HB effectively at close ranges you're going to have to at least one of two things:

    Be prepared and camp a flank or as narrow a corridor as possible so by the time someone see's you their already dead. Turreting in this mode is extremely effective. This is also extremely effective against SB's. It completely destroys their accuracy and makes them as effective as their knives. (Defensive)

    Offensively, you need to be with someone if you're assaulting something. You're a support character going against a very imbalanced system atm. HB's beat SB's as long as you're not right in front of them and you've got support.

    I hope this helps future play.
    ByeBye likes this.
  8. I'm hoping that there is movement improving equipment. I would like to play HB but only if it's mobile. I can't sit still that long. I need to be in the front or flanking it. I haven't found any places to set up that would allow me to do that. It sort of works camping in A, but I find that to be very boring. I prefer attacking.
  9. Forgrim Forj Battle-Skald

    Apparently I'm not good at this, since SB's tend to win even if I attack them first. It seems to me this is definitely a skill issue, since you're not the only one who has told me SB's are easy. I'm not sure what else I can do than brace/aim and shoot them - maybe try more for headshots.
    So true. I'm at my most effective when someone else is shooting with me, and I really do need at least one buddy to survive getting jumped. I wasn't expecting the HB to be a support class, but I'm starting to like it that way.
  10. Demetri Dominov Demetri_Dominov Arkhona Vanguard

    Try not to think of the HB as a normal rifle or a turret. Instead, use it to set up a firing lane you know you'll have control over - once you've dominated, move on to another, a HB is not good as a weapon to just sit around with either. While moving, move behind your team, but fire in front. A SB is extremely powerful and can still travel a decent distance. If anything, don't even set up if you get caught; stay calm, shoot a few rounds, set up, then pummel. Beware those with experience who will try to outflank you, even at close quarters.
    ByeBye likes this.

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