My favourite av weapon for tt was always the humble guardian anti grav with a vibro cannon. Specially in the old rule. Just choose a point on the board 48" away no line of sight needed. Draw out a tape measure between point and cannon everything it touches is hit infantry get a dodge save then only s4 hit if I remember correctly but if you have av and the higher the worse for you. The higher the av the easier to bust it open and worked on buildings to. That land raider is not just a pile of junk death trap. Very under used and could also go on wraith Lord. Suprise a lot of imperial guard tank mobs with that one. Nothing like losing upto four tanks in one shot.

Yeah Vibrocannons were awesome - Were

Originally they had a mighty 72" range meaning that you could hit anywhere on the tabletop... I'd put one in each corner and laugh as the enemies troops and tanks fell apart.

Also they had a strength equal to the target's toughness and their AP roll scaled to match the armour of the vehicle they were firing at.

The 2nd edition rules for them are here on page 64.


Anyway Dark reaper weapons.

I reckon you pretty much have to give them a wider choice of weapons as only having Reaper launchers would get boring really fast, even with different missile options.
I'd probably want to extend the choice a little more, but not hugely.. maybe add in a laser type lance weapon.


Back in the days of 2nd Ed days Exarchs were like mini characters, more like Autarchs are now -- only better.
With their Reaper range finders plus the Exarch powers crack shot and fast shot Dark reaper Exarchs were probably the best snipers in the game... At least till the Imperial assassins came along.

They could equip any weapon from the weapon cards, i.e. brightlances and firepike.. (There were cards for brightlances as well, only not in the codex .. I certainly remember fielding them).

Two types of missiles, to be exact: S5 AP3 Heavy2 and starswarm at S8 AP3 Heavy1

Brightlance or firepike options caa be a little op, so i'd prefer to start with exarch options available and add those two if necessary. But i don't think it will be necessary, though, reaper launcher, missile launcher and tempest launcher are fine choice for AV/anti-infantry options. With addition of shuriken cannon, which effective versus mobs of lightly-armored infantry, we have all our needs for heavy support covered.

There's some scope for them to add more types, maybe one's with a blast radius or that have other effects, however those two pretty much cover the range of what you would want a missile to do.
A big one to wreck vehicles and monstrous creatures and a little one to mow down normal troops.

Err yeah sorry ... I should have made it clear... The Brightlance back then was pretty different to how the Brightlance is now.
For a start it was small enough to be carried by a character and didn't count as a Heavy Weapon.

That said lance type weapon needn't be overpowered, and when I mentioned the old Brightlances and Firepikes I was talking more about the looks than the power.
When you're looking at weapons for the Dark Reapers you really have to consider their unique aesthetic.
They should look... well, Grim Reaper-ey.


The Reaper launchers, Missile launchers and Shuriken cannons are long weapons, held in both hands, and styled to be held like a scythe.. The only other Eldar weapon that really fits that look (other than the wraithcannon and that would be silly) are lance type weapons.

They obviously wouldn't be firepikes as that would tread on the toes of Fire Dragons, but some kind of laser lance would certainly look the part.

But yeah they should probably stick to the weapons that are available to Exarchs in 6th Ed.[/quote]

Missile launcher have blast and tempest launcher shoots like artillery/mortar, so we can cover those with another weapon, adding a visual style and without lore-bending, it should be ok.

As for that - i'm not sure that returning to previous editions will be good idea. Devs will need to seriously work on whole new balance then and it will be clearly different from what most players know. I don't like that idea personally, was disappointed enough with DoW2 Eldar. As for looks only - why not ? Previous editions skins without stats or functionality change - viable choice for founders pack, store item, or something alike. With this it can even be a shrieker cannon skin for shuriken cannon for example.

I'm inclined to agree.
From what we've heard so far it will most likely work like planetside 2, with the players able to completely change their 'class' on respawn, so getting stuck with a limited weapon choice isn't so bad.
So all that is needed for the Dark Reaper aspect warriors is something that will change up their battlefield role, even if it doesn't impact much on how they look .. and a choice of ammunition types can do that.

Don't get me wrong I'm not saying that they should do that, just that if I were to choose an extra weapon to give Dark Reapers or their Exarchs more of a range then a good choice cosmetically is the lance... For no better reason than the way it is held fits the Reaper 'scythe' motif.

Realistically speaking non standard weapons don't really impact on balance to any greater degree than any other weapon choice, so using balancing as an argument is a bit of a non starter. The distinctness argument however does have merit as a laser lance would probably have to be either:
A constant fire anti-troop sweeper, which would stand on the Shuriken Cannon's toes.
A Strong single target anti infantry weapon, which is pretty much the reaper launcher's role. or
A Strong anti-vehicle weapon, the missile launcher's role.

Since there is so much overlap it's definitely a candidate for a $$$ker-ching$$$ reskin.

Speaking of reskins, a shrieker cannon would make a poor choice as there's no unique shrieker look - at least none I'm aware of - and nothing specific to draw the inspiration from without stealing too much from Harlequin motifs.
In TT (and in lore from what I can tell) Shriekers look identical to a standard shuriken cannon. The big difference is the ammunition and what it does.

True, but whole weapon skin will be easier to add than allow decorating the weapon and make dozen or so elements for several spots. But if devs give us such an option, then srieker skin won't be needed and players surely be glad to customize their weapons. Anyway, if you mean add lances and pikes as customization options(i.e. skins) - i'm totally ok with that, if it will be weapons - i don't know, it somehow breaks the feel and diminishes chances on having Fire Dragons later, so i don't appreciate such idea.

id rather stay closer to there lore and what they can equip. if I can ill definitely play this class as eldar!

I voted the second option, but I can be flexible.

Shuricen cannon= eldar heavy bolter. We can note that the shuricen cannon is more mobile, but has less range. Should that be the same in-game? I do hope the shuricen cannon is anti-infantry, and we don't run into a situation of using massed shuricen fire as anti-tank.
Tbh: I'm not sure the shuricen cannon needs to be in game. The reaper launcher too should provide anti-infantry.
The 'dire avenger' class should heavily use a variety of shuricen weapons; for space marines there would be 'stalker pattern' bolters for long range etc. Eldar should have pretty much 'enough' shuricen weaponry, and maybe the 'shuricen cannon' should go to the dire avengers.

Dark reapers are semi-mobile: they can actually move slowly whilst firing. again discussable wether that should be in the game. Should the reaper launcher have more range than the heavy bolter etc.
Regarding the reaper launcher: how should that thing be aimed? Should the missiles fire in an arc, how to 'lead' the target, etc.
I think the missiles could have a several fire modes, depending on missile speed:
'dumb fire': straight ahead.
'chase reticle': launch missile, missile chases the reticle a bit.
seeking: missile launches 'dumb', but is heat seeking. Seeker activates at X m.
lock-on: hold a reticle over enemy, until beep. Missile follows this specific player.
Optical: 'TV-guided' missile from battlefield for example. You see through the missile and guide it.

Personally:
'speedy' missiles can be dumb launched.
'chase reticle': meh, not very good at this.
'seeking': not very skillfull. Hmm, maybe there's an enemy over there, I'll launch to check. Ooh, my missile went curvy, there he is.
TV-guided: at long range, this is not possible for 'star swarm', which should get a pretty high RoF: your second missile should launch whilst you are guiding the first. Pity, as it would be nice as a 'reaper-mode'.
That leaves 'lock-on'.
(* : an option would be that you launch and guide a cluster of missiles. But, would that 'cluster' magically converge to fit through cover/windows etc? eh.. )
So, how about a dual-fire mode for missiles: dumb, or 'lock-on'.
In that view: starswarm missiles would have a much shorter lockon than krak. (woops, I mean starshot, honest ) Firing 'lock-on' would always have a lower RoF: lock-on, launch, reload vs launch-reload. Starswarm might not need reloading; lock-on, launch, lock-on launch.
I'm open to letting krak lock-on to infantry. As long as lockon is long enough, it's fine. Don't run straight over open ground at the dude with the rocket launcher. That light at the end of the tunnel? Yeah, it's gonna get pretty bright exploding all over you. An anti-tank missile hit should hurt, even if you are carrying a storm shield/whatever.
Krak is anti-tank, but I think it is possible to add other missiles, like 'melta' missiles, etc: longer lock-on than krak/slower missile, but big vehicle dmg. 'Plasma' missile: lower RoF than starswarm, AoE dmg.
A good reason to launch with a lock-on mechanic is expansions: if flyers are ever added: good luck 'dumb' firing those down. At that point specialized anti-flyer missiles can be added. ('normal' krak missiles a flyer could try to avoid by manoevring). Skyfire missiles would move faster, and deal bonus dmg vs flyers.
'Haywire' missiles are an eldar alternative to melta missiles (if melta is fire-dragon only): temporary hinder vehicles systems vs massive damage.

Balance wise: you can bring whatever missiles you want.
But: they come in ammo clips/ammo packs.
One clip could be 30 starswarm, or 12 'krak' (these would be basic krak), or 15 plasma, or 12 skyfire, or 10 haywire, or 5 melta. You can only bring 5? ammo clips. Adjust numbers up/down (12 anti-tank missiles in a row? But, I do expect my reaper launcher to be able to fire a bit before needing to reload.. That's kinda the point of the eldar missile launchers...)

Besides the missile launcher, I could see the tempest launcher (rapid fire, arced plasma missiles), but how do you use that indoors? The 'arc' should be pretty straight.. Dual fire mode: straight & dumb, or 'artillery'?

Then, the starcannon, as 'anti-elite'/anti-hero: when mr Terminator comes along, a bit of plasma should brighten up his day. Starcannon would bring the highest anti-infantry dps of eldary heavies, but no locking on, no missile versatility, and (suggestion), no 'dumb' firing on the move. Finally, slightly less range than the missiles.

This would leave the bright lance and scatter laser: tbh, I'd leave 'laser' weapons to aspects like swooping hawks. Call em hawk lances and scatter blasters.. somehow, these dudes need to be able to compete with an assault space marine, or take down an enemy shooting a heavy bolter at em..

I would think allowing the Exarch weapons is a good compromise between class versatility and lore-preservation.