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AV and Fire Dragons - Is this one class THE reason why Eldar win so many matches?

Discussion in 'Eldar' started by Orkan, Mar 16, 2017.

  1. Orkan Orkan Arkhona Vanguard

    The game is too dependant on its Planetside inspired spawn mechanics. I think a good solution would be to either do away with mobile spawn transports completely and allow unlimited transports without timers which would serve the dual purpose of utilising more of the map and allowing mobile infantry lines of advance over larger parts of the map as well as diminishing the importance of the Fire Dragon and AV in general. AV would still be important as destroying Main Battle Tanks and full transports enroute to objective would be key to slowing an advance but it would not be as crucial to match win/loss as it is now.

    Allowing limited 'deepstrike' deploy mechanics for the attackers and allowing unlimited or cheaper 'deepstrike' deployments for the defenders (which effectively is defenders spawning on a point they own already but instead through a new animated graphical structure such as drop pod or webway gate) would enable them to deploy all over the map as now.

    I should add that deepstrike deployments would work best if they spawned 5 recently killed team members together.
    Brujah likes this.
  2. Orkan Orkan Arkhona Vanguard

    Failing that another solution would be to change the mobile spawn transports into faction variants [Eg shielded waveserpent, Damocles Rhino etc) where they work the same as presently only are 3-4times tougher and are spawned much more rarely. These special vehicles only spawnable by each team a few times a match would be incredibley tough mobile mobile spawn transports which would require coordinated teamwork to take down. These in effect would become mobile secondary objectives to take down, necessary to defend as attackers and to destroy as defenders.

    A mix of the two above ideas could also work.

    Respawning could be based on a tickets system where more effective redeploymnets cost a set number of tickets eg deepstrike costs 2 tickets, transport spawn costs 1, and spawning in your team's start zone is always free with minimal cooldown.

    Respawning mechanics are technically a seperate subject which should warrant their own thread but for now are relevant as we realise that the games present AV system is a direct counter to spawn mechanics in recent and the present patch and has become the present meta.
    Brujah likes this.
  3. Orkan Orkan Arkhona Vanguard

    Perhaps this why I am a motivated and successful Fire Dragon. I really enjoy Armour gameplay. I enjoy driving, as well as gunning. I am the type of player that will happily sit in the tank the whole match. I am also not the only player who enjoys this type of gameplay. You do not have to be worried about that. Presently this position does not get xp rewards but hopefully it will do soon and you will see more mobile transports around as players begin to benefit more directly from this gameplay. Keeping it mobile and utilising it as a force multiplier to get firepower on the right objective at the right time. As it happens this ties in so well with being able to enable my whole squad to keep spawning on where I am in my tank (wave serpent) and here lies another irony.

    Transports are even better than Main Battle tanks as they contain not only a repair medicenter but also a mobile resupply crate. That means mobile infinite ammo! Not only is my vehicle equipped with the omnipotent 'Undeathinator Teleportarium Device' (Mobile Spawn - the most OP device in the known universe) it also carries all the ammo I will ever need. Ironically as my tank weapons are useless I become the actual weapon as I drive myself to point blank range and unload myself adjacent to my target transport. Drop my melta bombs or a charge of heat and Boom, job done.
    If I'm working with a teammate or two then the tank transport is always gunned and always mobile and even more deadly.

    Remove the mobile spawn from the game and you remove a lot of the problems caused by it and end up with a more balanced and fun game dependant on teamwork to get all the troops to the right place at the right time.

    Right now mobile spawns make the game too easy and mean we always teleport to the same points without using the rest of the maps to their full potential.

    One last point about mobile spawn. There exists two types of mentality surrounding this. There is the, let's call it 'Planetside' mentality which insists on mobile spawn being parked and guarded as close to the point as possible and there is the 'Mobile Cavalry' mentality that sees a parked transport as a dead transport and a mobile transport as a surviving transport. These two viewpoints are not easily reconcileable between the types of people who hold them. Both approaches have their advantages and disadvantages and perhaps the best method is to employ the right tactic at the right time.
    Whitefox550, Brujah and Dragonkindred like this.
  4. to be fair, Eldar aren't OP we're just good at the game.
    Whitefox550 likes this.
  5. Sarise Sarise Active Member

    Make it so all meltabomb equivalents are disarmed if shot. Done deal, never a problem again. This one simple and practical change would literally fix the entire game forever.
  6. Shiani Brujah Preacher

    @Orkan

    Some excellent musings going on there. If, as you suggest, you want to do away with mobile spawns altogether, how would you envisage respawning working in the game? Would people spawn to Captured Points or home bases and be collected by other players driving vehicles?
  7. 'He who controls the spice, controls the universe.' - Frank Herbert

    'He who controls the vehicles, controls Arkhona.' - Brent Ellison

    Well Brent never said it but he may as well have. :)

    And we've all known it since Rhino's hit Alpha. Cut the supply of enemy troops to the points and you win the game. You can do that by fighting outside the point and literally cutting them down between vehicle and point or you can drop the vehicle. Fighting the enemy is more fun, dropping the vehicle is more effective.

    Maybe it's in the Eldar mindset because we have a class that drops vehicles easily but can't really do much else but it's pretty much ingrained into successful Eldar gameplay?

    What I find supprising is that the F2P guys even though they're given a dedicated AV loadout don't destroy vehicles. Free XP, obviously important but you end up with 3 or 4 vehicles just sat about for the whole match. F2P dragons are all over that. F2P LSM or Chaos not so much. (not PuG'd with Orks since F2P what with all the outage stuff that was happening so can't comment) Got me gold weapons on LSM/CSM with AV play Req even with the outages over the weekend and it's a game winner.

    Not a skill thing, not much skill in running up to a rhino and pushing G twice to be fair. (Sorry @Orkan I know there's more to it than that I'm just making a rhetorical point!)

    Must be an attitude thing:EldarWarlock:
    Sumshine, DiputsLasarach and Maensith like this.
  8. Maensith Subordinate

    "Beware of the eldar orangutans for if there is even one of them nearby, you can never have your guava. I've seen these abominations taking guava from my brothers - that was terrible...." - Belial, Space Marines faction leader
    Rivindesh and Dragonkindred like this.
  9. Valentine Iyan Firebrand

    Give us Myamera's Shadow Spectres! =p Then we'd always get guavas.
    DiputsLasarach and Orkan like this.
  10. Xile Xile Member

    Eldar meta B lining for vehicles and trying to blow them up in seconds and repeat? come on Eldar you deserve better than that fix the game BE.
    Orkan likes this.

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