I'm not complaining about Orks, I think orks are in a perfect spot right now, despite the general air of dismay, I'm complaining about the abundance of insane requests of LSM players demanding they get special treatment because Space Marines are special.

Yes, we were bullet sponges, and also yes, headshotting us was way easier.

Yes, our guns work well up and close, but speaking of accuracy when you are at point-blank range of an enemy isn't really discussing the subject of accuracy.

I'm not asking for anything for Orks here, I'm just happy to play a greenskin because I love them, and would play them even if they were absolutely statless, basic boy cannon fodder. I might just simply not see where all the LSM complaints are coming from because I play against them constantly, and I see their survivability as okay, provided they don't run into a group of 5 orks.

As orks, we also experience seeing LSM stacking armor and us unloading a clip on them to no avail unless you're a heavy suppressing fire class, that's just how things are. It's just about adapting, I don't feel like I cut through LSM like they were butter, provided they show some prowess in the game.

The faction who's meant to be good at close range is good at close range? BWUUUUH?

But yeah, bolters are better at long range, shootaz are better up close hip-firing. Shootaz are too inaccurate/have too much recoil to be that effective at long range. The dead shiney shootaz is better, but it does only like 16 damage at long range(like the normal shoota), and you'll never kill anyone. The best you'll do is annoy.

All I know is that before yesterday's patch. Orks were much easier to play than CSM. I'm not saying that easier to play equals a team win. I am saying that it is easier to kill LSM and CSM with an ork than it is for me to kill a LSM as a CSM. Also, I have never won a 1:1 fight with a Wolf Priest as a CSM. I have won as an ork.

@Ihsahn
Ok test the Apothecary and Painboy syringe out. No damage bonus for the rear attacks, just like you thought.

Small Tyranid target fast attack 81 front/back and heavy attack 138 front and back.

A massive painboy rush on assault in a fortress map where everyone throws poison everywhere is absolutely devastating. On that newer map I manage to suicide rush to the back and down 2 or 3 heavies who just sit in the cloud. That is usually one guy forcing around 4 to 6 people to respond to a single person. Multiply the number of painboyz rushing at once and nurgle becomes green with envy.

@Orsus
Apo also has no Backstab bonus?

@Ihsahn
Correct, neither have a backstabbing bonus and both are the same damage.

Lsm got advantage at range thats fact.
Orks should have advantage up close and they got it.

I could live with that even as you all act like nobs which is silly lore vise and not right with tabletop rules too. Problem is that all current gameplay oscilate around fighting at bo's entombed inside buildings where close range got upper hand when fighting in open field got no sense objective vise. U cant negate that simple truth when you wage about fraction balance. If some other game mode will be implemented like deadmatch in some open areas then range of Lsm weapons could get some meaning. For now even if you shoot at someone in longer range there is so many obstracles that you can kill it only if your pray are not willing to get cover. Lsm dont have 2 shot killing weapon like Abaddon's Grace autocannon. Try kill someone with stalker bolter even if your target is braced.... there is allways time for reaction. Lascannon dont count in dynamit environment even Burning Light one.

Um...you guys are stronger in close range then we are though.