I have a feeling that the ACE dakka, is a unique deffgun and as such, counted as one (we didn't see abbadons grace but autocannon in the chaos stats for example)

Yea it's entirely possible, just not guaranteed as others would have you believe.

I just told you, suppression doesn't exist on the AC as you were implying in you statement in

You posting a video of someone being suppressed doesn't change the fact of what a weapon does in the current patch. If you don't believe me, test in the garrison.

The Kannon Deffgun is what i use when I'm hungover and want to farm kills without paying much attention.

I don't particularly want it to be nerfed, but anyone who thinks it isn't going to get smacked down a peg is kidding themselves.

Dear Emperor how can you be this dense.

Ok, let's do this step by step.

Here's the Hawk's List:

1. Hawk's Talon
2. LasBlaster
3. Ceremonial Knife
4. Sunrifle
5. Hawkseeker Grenade (Yes)

If, at any point, they had not lumped Mastercrafted and Unique's together, the list would probably look something like this (Bolded for original top 5):

1. Hawk's Talon
2. Mastercrafted Hawk's Talon
3. Hunter's Mark
4. LasBlaster
5. Ceremonial Knife
6. Heatseeker Knife
7. Cloudsweeper
8. Sunrifle
9. Mastercrafted Knife
10. Mastercrafted Lasblater
11. Mastercrafted Sunrifle
12. That silly 3-burst gun that is simply horrendous
13. Hawkseeker Grenades

Do you think having basically the same weapon taking the top 3 spots (Out of atop 5) list would be interesting, or let alone useful information for an infographic? No. The same would happen for Havoc's list (Which would be the AC, MC AC, and AG taking 3 spots).

Basic, common sense on how to display info would be to lump all unique and MC weapons together.

The other alternative is to disregard all these weapons, but then your data isn't reliable, which is also not a good idea.

AC doesn't have suppression. Playing any one game against chaos could have easily answered that question.

What AC does have is the standard "Getting shot" increase in spread, which all weapons have. Basically you get a very slight increase in spread when actually getting shot (While suppression only needs the bullets to be near). The increase is super negligible however, and basically equates to the increase you'd get from shooting a single bullet with your weapon.

@Gazrick The Ace Dakka has suppression. The heavy bolter has suppression too. However, it's important to know that the difference is huge between them. The heavy bolter provides proper suppression, really making you unable to fire back. The Ace Dakka meanwhile, makes the target marker slightly bigger. It's tiny suppression, exactly like @Wiawyr mentions when getting shot at. It's the exact same level of suppression. I think when speaking of suppression, one should probably factor in that all suppression weapons provide more suppression against the orks, than anyone else. It's sometimes crazy, like if a heavy bolter is firing at a target 20 meters away from you, the developers seem to take control of your mouse and throw it all around until the firing stops.

Before this patch, the autocannons had a higher penetration (+10) than the ace dakka, now they're both equal in that department too. So it's getting pretty close.

Personally, I feel that playing with an autocannon is easier. It's put on a better more mobile less buggy character, the lesser ammo supply has virtually no effect, and I've no problem with facing Ace dakkas with autocannons. Moreoever, I think that the Ace Dakka did get lumped into the statistics for the regular deffgun, because the regular deffgun is one of the worst heavy weapons in the game and noone uses it. It's just an inferior heavy bolter. Still, I wouldn't want the Ace Dakka nerfed further.

Ork melee is the worst in the game, especially considering reach. Their vehicles are the worst in the game. Most of their shooting weapons are inferior to the equivalents of the marine factions. They've the worst anti-vehicle in the game. It's the Ace Dakka and to a smaller extent, the big shoota, that keeps them having even a chance and even then it's an uphill battle. Nerfing the Ace Dakka is a nail in the coffin for the most underplayed, underpowered faction. Even in a vacuum, I don't see the weapon as an issue in its current form. Indeed, even the latest nerf was unnecessary, the only nerf it did deserve was the very first one.

Oh we're talking about the current patch now? So I guess all the rubbish wia spewed earlier regarding HTK is totally worthless and moot then?

So do you have any proof or a valid reason why they would shove the Ace Dakka in with the standard Deffgun? Because to me the fact that they share a model and an advancement is not proof. In addition - it is a very different thing to say "this is what happened" and to say "this is what I think happened". Look at your original post, please you make claims based on assumptions as if they're gospel.

I don't think you've seen the increase in spread on an ork character if you believe it to be negligible. I thought that suppression and head shots only increased spread on your enemy's weapon. Now you're telling me by taking a hit it completely fucks my aim? And I don't mean it slightly increases my reticule - I mean my reticule dances all over the screen so much it almost gives me a seizure with the amount of shaking of the screen. This shit is intended? Unbelievable.

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the entire point of suppression to weaken the enemy's ability to aim at me and attack back? If all weapons can do this remind me what the benefit is (apart from the map ping).

So let me get this straight. Different weapons provide different levels of suppression? Not all suppression is the same? It also affects different factions more than others? As with the 'you got shot, Fuck your aim' mechanic?

This has to be one of the most blindingly stupid design decisions I have ever heard of.

Regardless I'm sure all those CSM tear jerkers will continue to play the victim card until they get more grenades and toys, while nerfing other factions into the ground. They're as bad as LSM (if not worse) these days.

Yes, suppression is not the same for all weapons. Heavy bolter has the most, Ace dakka the least.
Yes, when they buffed suppression they accidentally, hopefully, made it more effective against orks. One can wish it is temporary and fixed soon.

The thing is its not just suppression. Apparently just TAKING a hit messes with our spread. Since ork weapons have the highest spread in the game this is a pretty big problem and no doubt is part of the reason other factions have been able to roll over us in what should be equal battles. Now I'm being told we suffer this effect more?! The Fuck is going on at bE when they make these design decisions? Are they actively trying to kill the xenos factions?

Dey got Nerfmarines, dat is all